This could be interesting. One of the very first GT500s built in 1967. A "pre-production" engineering car to study Conelec fuel injection. Super rare this may be one of the only GT500s that ever had a 428 Cobra Jet installed by the factory. If you are a Shelby fan, this should be awesome.
https://www.barrett-jackson.com/Events/Event/Details/1968-SHELBY-GT500-245468
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/8-130221075328.jpeg)
If anyone needs more information or just has questions on this historical car - feel free to email me or post them up here. Break open those piggy banks! It is your chance to have a truly unique vehicle that has never been shown in public before. If you know anything about factory engineering cars or know someone that does, I am also interested in what they have to say.
Coralsnake68@hotmail.com
Man, if I had to pick just one, this one might be it. Super cool.
Needs a MUCH better write-up on the auction site!
Standby Don, that's coming right up.
I think you are going to see a lot of hoop-la
bet it cost more than i bought it for last time :P I will be watching !
I won't be surprised if Pete sells his house to buy it. A house is just a house...and doesn't have Conelec F.I.
I have had several opportunities, but am focused on other projects! I am not saying those are not EFI cars 8)
Wow - pretty impressive!
I wonder how much of a difference the Conelec system makes.
Pete - thoughts?
Sadly, I canceled my Barrett Jackson trip yesterday. I would have loved to see this one in person.
I honestly don't remember the numbers on horse power and torque vs the carburetor. They were more, not significantly as I do recall.
Was the 101 restoration thread lost with the crash of Forum 1.0? That would be a shame. Lots of good stuff!
Quote from: KR Convertible on February 13, 2021, 06:13:14 PM
Was the 101 restoration thread lost with the crash of Forum 1.0? That would be a shame. Lots of good stuff!
Yep it was lost I still have most of the photos / after trying to revive the 00212 thread and it was met with mixed results / i decided not to attempt the 101 o r 545 threads
That sucks!
It may not be posted, but it is not lost.
Let me know what you have interest in and I will try to help
I know the info wasn't lost, but the thread was lost from public view. That thread was around 15 pages loaded with great pictures and details about this special car. The thread would have been a great resource for potential bidders.
I don't remember the details of the motor. Born with a PI? Later CJ parts added? Conelec added to CJ? Wasn't 101 also a stereo test car? I seem to remember extra sound deadening.
Was it a dual VIN? Pre strike?
I will be happy to re post any and all photographs I have. Potential bidders can also contact me.
All GT500s were originally equipped with 428 police interceptors. The engine for 101 was changed by Shelby/Ford engineers to a 428 Cobra Jet. It was also upgraded to Conelec fuel injection.
The car was also used to test "69 sound package" which has been determined to be extra sound deadners and insulation similar to a Mach 1. "Torque sensitive" rear axle which is a locking axle with added Cougar style axle insulators.
The car retains an original AM radio.
Initially it was thought the "sound package" maybe related to the radio, but it was determined not to be the case.
Thanks Pete. Awesome details.
Very cool!
I will do my best to post some of Phil's old photos and photos I have.
I will do some digging on the old laptop see what i can find
What would the expected price range b fir this car ?
It looks like a nice restoration.,
Dab
I believe the car is no reserve. North of $400k, would be my "guess", but auctions are unpredictable. Some other rare Shelbys will be at this auction as well, that should help.
Not a dual serial number car. It likely was and then updated as it stayed at the factory.
After Serial Number 101 left Shelby Engineering it went to Courtesy Ford in Littleton, Colorado.
I believe this is the original sales advertisement
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/8-150221174109.jpeg)
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/8-150221174125.jpeg)
From the larger ad above, This was 1969 and according to Vincent Liska, this was the only Gold fastback at Courtesy during this time frame.
The late 1970's after getting a fresh black paint job
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/8-160221195900.jpeg)
It is believed the ram air hood was original to the car. The plenum appears to be hand made and was not like the factory molded part.
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/8-160221200112.jpeg)
Pete has a whole write up on this car on his web site thecoransnake.com, from when he restored it.
I can post more here-leading up to auction
Just in case anyone is a consultant for a buyer 😀
or THE Buyer.
Here is the end result
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=QI6raT_epFc
That's the stuff!
Can you tell us more about how the Conelec system works? I assume there are no O2 sensors. How is mixture controlled? Is it a sequential system? How is it timed? What adjustments are there?
I can try, but there is a certain amount of witchcraft and hocus pocus
This is pre oxygen sensors, later versions (post Shelby) did use oxygen sensors. Ford continued this program after Shelby closed their doors.
Timing comes directly from the number one plug wire
Firing is not sequential it is all cylinders at once
The mixture ratio is preprogrammed and controlled by the computer based on rpms (I think)
After initial set up there are no adjustments necessary
Heres a great document
Shelby Engineering inventory
I redacted the serial numbers
Note Engineers called the color Sunlit Gold "Bronze"
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/8-170221143059.jpeg)
Quote from: KR Convertible on February 13, 2021, 06:13:14 PM
Was the 101 restoration thread lost with the crash of Forum 1.0? That would be a shame. Lots of good stuff!
Back up anything you read now before the next crash!
Is this a better description?
Shelby # 101, 1968 Shelby GT500 pre-production test vehicle. -When you buy this car, you will not only be getting an extremely rare vehicle, but you will also be getting a history lesson in Shelby pre-production vehicles and engineering test vehicles. Equipped with a 428 Cobra Jet engine with super-rare Conelec fuel injection system. Only one other vehicle has this factory EFI system. Ford C-6 transmission and special torque-sensitive, locking rear axle. This car has factory air conditioning. Original Sunlit Gold over a black Shelby deluxe, interior. This car has original identification tags and owner history. Comes with rare Ford and Conelec paperwork documenting its rare engineering history. Car received a Concours Gold Award at Muscle Car and Corvette Nationals. Other rare features include, factory, handmade fiberglass parts, pre-production console, one of a kind rear axle mounting, special sound deadner, pre-production taillights and 1969 style tires and shocks. Fully documented concours restoration by a noted Shelby historian. Owner history and personal accounts of the car are included. Only two of the three original fuel injection, engineering test vehicles exist and this may be your only opportunity to own a piece of Shelby Automotive history.
Quote from: Coralsnake on February 19, 2021, 05:55:30 PM
Is this a better description?
Shelby # 101, 1968 Shelby GT500 pre-production test vehicle. -When you buy this car, you will not only be getting an extremely rare vehicle, but you will also be getting a history lesson in Shelby pre-production vehicles and engineering test vehicles. Equipped with a 428 Cobra Jet engine with super-rare Conelec fuel injection system. Only one other vehicle has this factory EFI system. Ford C-6 transmission and special torque-sensitive, locking rear axle. This car has factory air conditioning. Original Sunlit Gold over a black Shelby deluxe, interior. This car has original identification tags and owner history. Comes with rare Ford and Conelec paperwork documenting its rare engineering history. Car received a Concours Gold Award at Muscle Car and Corvette Nationals. Other rare features include, factory, handmade fiberglass parts, pre-production console, one of a kind rear axle mounting, special sound deadner, pre-production taillights and 1969 style tires and shocks. Fully documented concours restoration by a noted Shelby historian. Owner history and personal accounts of the car are included. Only two of the three original fuel injection, engineering test vehicles exist and this may be your only opportunity to own a piece of Shelby Automotive history.
What was the " one of a kind rear axle mounting "
What was the " one of a kind rear axle mounting "
Quote from: Coralsnake on February 19, 2021, 05:55:30 PM
Is this a better description?
Shelby # 101, 1968 Shelby GT500 pre-production test vehicle. -When you buy this car, you will not only be getting an extremely rare vehicle, but you will also be getting a history lesson in Shelby pre-production vehicles and engineering test vehicles. Equipped with a 428 Cobra Jet engine with super-rare Conelec fuel injection system. Only one other vehicle has this factory EFI system. Ford C-6 transmission and special torque-sensitive, locking rear axle. This car has factory air conditioning. Original Sunlit Gold over a black Shelby deluxe, interior. This car has original identification tags and owner history. Comes with rare Ford and Conelec paperwork documenting its rare engineering history. Car received a Concours Gold Award at Muscle Car and Corvette Nationals. Other rare features include, factory, handmade fiberglass parts, pre-production console, one of a kind rear axle mounting, special sound deadner, pre-production taillights and 1969 style tires and shocks. Fully documented concours restoration by a noted Shelby historian. Owner history and personal accounts of the car are included. Only two of the three original fuel injection, engineering test vehicles exist and this may be your only opportunity to own a piece of Shelby Automotive history.
Yes, Pete. I sent you a PM.
Thank you Don!
Here is the rear axle mount. I suspect a Cougar guy may recognize this part. It is a bracket welded to the axle perch and a rubber "sandwich" for the leaf spring
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/8-200221081123.jpeg)
...the car also had these rebound bumpers similar to a 1967. I have seen these on one of the other pre-production 1968s
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/8-200221081519.jpeg)
Here is another document I think provides some important insight into car # 101. The original is written in cursive, but this is a little easier to read.
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/8-200221085904.jpeg)
First are the dates. The memo indicates that there are "five" pre-production cars. Kevin Marti originally identified four cars by their early (pre-strike) build dates. These were 41, 56, 301 and 339. Each had a specific engineering purpose. All five cars were finished before regular production started.
Car 101 is the fifth car based on the pre-production taillights and other items found on the car. Interestingly all were Sunlit Gold and all were repainted at the factory. When I restored 101, I painted all the fender bolts to signify this. Of course, there is no way the car ever looked like it does now with regards to neatness and quality.
So when they say those bolts were never painted, you can say there is a reason for it and it was done intentionally. ;D
This blueprint links Conelec and Shelby. Its not the only document, but certainly one of the coolest. Copies of all these unique, rare documents will be provided to the new owner. The original is 36" x 55"
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/8-200221091456.jpeg)
I will have to make a list of oddities on this car today. The more I look, the more I recall.
😀
This is great, Pete. Thanks!
Here is the list I came up with: Unique or odd features of Shelby # 101
Preproduction and early style "hand laid" fiberglass
Ram Air (not usually found on GT500s)
Tail Light treatment found on only on preproduction cars
Emblem location on front fender not standardized
Electronic Fuel Injection
428 Cobra Jet engine (Engineering installed) with starter delay added
Unique console, console gauges and arm rest pad
rear axle mounting and snubbers
No hood seal on radiator support
Sound deadner package
Most likely repainted at AO Smith to make fiberglass match
This is the pre-production tail light treatment. This would before the steel ball shaped cups.
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/8-210221121017.jpeg)
Quote from: Coralsnake on February 17, 2021, 08:31:48 AM
I can post more here-leading up to auction
Just in case anyone is a consultant for a buyer 😀
or THE Buyer.
Here is the end result
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=QI6raT_epFc
any idea why do many of these cars went to Colorado? Little Red, Eric's car(67 500) and #101?
I can only surmise someone there had a connection and wanted the used cars. All the cars (new and used) from Pletcher Ford went there when that dealership closed down.
Looks like they have updated the auction listing for Don!
Chuckle.
Don, just a few more weeks and you can bid away!
I will post some of the pre restoration photos Soon
Some of these are Phils photos. He did a great job working on the car
They represent some of the extra sound deadner. I will go into how I deducted that "sound pkg" was actually sound deadner
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/8-240221182910.jpeg)
Obviously not normal applications of deadner and all done at the same time.
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/8-240221182634.jpeg)
Even under the car, so someone had a goal in mind, the presence of the factory style jute inside the car was also a clue
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/8-240221182605.jpeg)
One day I found someone that had posted a bunch of invoices they found. These were for 1969 cars. But, one notation stood out to me. NVH is noise, vibration and harshness. A very common feature on a 1969 Mach 1, tested on a 1968 Shelby before the introduction of the Mach 1
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/8-240221183628.jpeg)
thanks for posting ! interesting doc. I noticed bottom left, very faint lettering, Ship to... "Service Research Centre"
Also top centre Dealer No. 892 03J, where, and who was that ?
Mike
I have no ideas, that document really has no connection to 101 other than providing the key to deciphering the "sound package" notation on the engineering inventory sheet
Quote from: honker on February 24, 2021, 07:36:06 PM
thanks for posting ! interesting doc. I noticed bottom left, very faint lettering, Ship to... "Service Research Centre"
Also top centre Dealer No. 892 03J, where, and who was that ?
Mike
The facility on Oakwood Blvd. was just down the street from the Dearborn Proving Grounds.
https://www.autoevolution.com/news/1-of-3-1968-shelby-gt500-efi-prototypes-surfaces-used-to-test-fuel-injected-428-157187.html#
reformed Head judge or former Head judge to be slightly more accurate
Quote from: Coralsnake on March 05, 2021, 08:33:56 AM
reformed Head judge or former Head judge to be slightly more accurate
Reformed sounds good... glad all that therapy helped... ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
How are the "injectors" attached to the engine? Are there "metered pills" attached to ports in the heads or the intake manifold?
This is not a timed injection system? They are shooting all of the time?
How is the fuel timed?
This is timed . I will get you some photos today of injectors and intakes.
There is a electrical trigger attached to the ignition system that fires the injectors.
Will the famous coralsnake make an appearance at BJ auction to help sell this special car ? If he shows up i will buy him a drink!!
I appreciate that Ed, sightings have been rare in recent years. The Coralsnake has a masters degree in social distancing.
Unfortunately, I had to decline the invitation.
But, I am planning to attend the Indiana event.
Well thats better yet then as lots to do and see in french lick area for the whole family and by late october should be safe to travel and we wont have restrictions this year like last year.
Here is a picture of the injectors on the Green Hornet XE intake. They are bent so the head goes into the top of the combustion chamber. The manifold holes are tapered and each injector is a press fit.
When the ignition trigger is activated, all eight injectors fire.
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/8-140321102541.jpeg)
Im getting excited, I have high expectations for this car at the auction. I see the photographs have been updated
https://www.barrett-jackson.com/Events/Event/Details/1968-SHELBY-GT500-245468
Pete,
Thanks for all you have done to get 101 ready for this auction. I share your excitement and hope she lands with someone who truly values her.
8)
Interesting system. Do you know the trigger frequency on 720 degrees of crank rotation. Wondering how they managed to get a evenly distributed A/F mixture on all 8 cylinders.
Quote from: Coralsnake on March 14, 2021, 10:31:17 AM
Im getting excited, I have high expectations for this car at the auction. I see the photographs have been updated
https://www.barrett-jackson.com/Events/Event/Details/1968-SHELBY-GT500-245468
That is one very nice car! So odd not to see the Caution Fan decal. ;)
I hope to get you some answers to metering questions soon
I could see with that set up that during a injection cycle a few cylinders would be on a optimal amount of fuel atomization while others would be slightly timed too early and others too late. Hang time in the intake runners waiting for the intake valve to open the possible drawback. Some more modern systems used to alternate 2 cylinders at a time on 4 cly engines. Very forward thinking at the time and I suspect less problematic system than the Rochester units that preceded it. Would be cool to see it running and maybe put a temp gun on the exhaust runners to see how even they are.
A nice 4 page spread in the BJ preview magazine I just got ,with a nice Pete mention
Here's the video preview
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=-LsKmrLi2Bo (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=-LsKmrLi2Bo)
And more photos on their website
Sorry for the delay on the fuel delivery system. From memory its triggered by a sensor on the number 1 plug wire. I couldnt find the exact rate but it is calibrated to engine speed and measured in milliseconds. The specific curve is programmed into the computer and there is a heat sensor, but this is pre-oxygen sensor. There is a barometric sensor that also gives input.
The potentiometer cards were a challenge as there are very places that could reproduce these. Luckily, the company I actually found to make them was only an hour away from my house and I needed special clearance to even visit them, because of their classified government work.
Thank you for the US military.
Ok. I gotta ask. What's up with the white shocks? At first I thought they were KYBs. After looking at more pictures, it looks like they have the disk below the upper bushing eye like the adjustable shocks. Pre-production parts?
When one does a restoration there are always decisions to be made. :)
This car was originally left with the engineering department well into the 1969 model year.
The decision was taken to "upgrade" the tires to the GY black side walls , like a KR and the 1969 style Shelby shock absorbers to represent that.
Ah. That makes sense. Thanks.
You may also see the front fender bolts are painted body color.
This represents the car being repainted after it was built, per an internal memorandum
I think you had mentioned the fender bolts previously. The things I found unusual were the shocks, tires and lack of
comfortweave.
I also seem to remember the electronic controller being mounted to the front of the console. The pictures show it mounted to the radiator support.
Correct. Initially there was some evidence the computer was external on this car, but I do agree inside would have been more correct. Especially when I found evidence on the console of its original mounting location.
Very early cars tend to have smooth seats
I did a short synopsis of many of these odd features for the new owner. Its included with the car 🙂
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/8-240321161248.jpeg)
Was there a 428cj installed in September 1967 for these tests ?
I think that is very unlikely. We dont have the exact date it was installed. It was more likely early 1968 CY.
Is this the car that was owned by Jan and then Gale in the '80's that had a 427 in it for awhile?
Yes, they are previous owners.
Quote from: Coralsnake on March 25, 2021, 07:02:09 AM
Yes, they are previous owners.
Here is a couple of pictures from Hallett Roadway in Tulsa from about 1986-87. Gale is in both pictures. The license plate on the car is GT 427. I had just been given rides in both the Shelby and the BOSS.
Oh good stuff! Thanks for posting!
Lets get this party started
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/8-250321190037.jpeg)
Pictures of Barrett-Jackson display
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/8-260321092114.jpeg)
^^^ Very nice display!
I would imagine Conelec hasn't had this much marketing since the late '60s early '70s :D
- Phillip
I think you are correct
Before 101 goes live today, I wanted to once again thank Pete for all his help, guidance and wisdom putting her back to her engineering days. I would have trusted no other person and all I can say is that Pete is the best, and i am grateful to know him and call him a friend.
101 is a special and unique Shelby. She will be the legacy car in the Shelby history books that she deserves to be.
Also a call out to Phil for making me aware of her 10 years ago. Who would have thought Phil? Time has flown by!
Also to Jason Billups and Mike McCullough, who assured me she would get special attention, marketing and recognition at Barrett-Jackson. They delivered on all three of those commitments, and quite frankly...........101, Shelby, Conelec and Pete Disher deserved it.
Hope she lands in great hands and is showcased for all to appreciate.
It needs it's own theme song music. Best of luck on the auction.
Quote from: shelbydoug on March 27, 2021, 09:14:50 AM
It needs it's own theme song music. Best of luck on the auction.
She sure does! Thanks Doug!
Quote from: Illinicane on March 27, 2021, 09:09:15 AM
Before 101 goes live today, I wanted to once again thank Pete for all his help, guidance and wisdom putting her back to her engineering days. I would have trusted no other person and all I can say is that Pete is the best, and i am grateful to know him and call him a friend.
101 is a special and unique Shelby. She will be the legacy car in the Shelby history books that she deserves to be.
Also a call out to Phil for making me aware of her 10 years ago. Who would have thought Phil? Time has flown by!
Hope she lands in great hands and is showcased for all to appreciate.
10 YEARS! damn time flys .
Good luck tonight hope the new owner shares the car with the public .
I was afraid the gold color would tamp down the final sale price a bit - thankfully not. A very interesting car, well presented, and sold for a very good price. Congratulations to all involved!
Now that it's over, could we hear comments on how the FI setup affected power and driveability?
Royce I dont have the exact specs for 101 but they are quoted in the Green Hornet documentary. Both cars have the 428 Cobra Jet engines. There is much better drive ability because you have no cold start issues and immediate throttle response.
Was it Craig Jackson who bought the car? He obviously loves those prototypes. Also, isn't there a third car (a 1969 black Shelby fastback?) that has the Conelec system on it? I recall seeing a Utube video of it some time ago.
Craig did not buy the car. I think he may have bid on it.
There are currently just two cars that have the Conelec EFI- The gold fastback and the Green Hornet.
I did have it on my 1969 GT350, but it has been removed and returned to its original carburation set up.
I suspect that the lack of putting the FI into production is circumstantial evidence that the Shelby program was ending or "they" knew it was.
It's actually a pretty good system that should have had more serious consideration for production if not just for the Shelbys.
EFI in general cleans up the exhaust emissions and because it is more focus able on every change in rpm as can be seen now with CPU controlled fuel supply, offers the possibility of more power, cleaner and more economical use of fuel. Who can argue with that?
Well the fact is that the Conolec system didn't get used in production by any manufacturer, likely due to a failure of cost versus benefit.
Quote from: shelbydoug on March 28, 2021, 10:42:30 AM
I suspect that the lack of putting the FI into production is circumstantial evidence that the Shelby program was ending or "they" knew it was.
It's actually a pretty good system that should have had more serious consideration for production if not just for the Shelbys.
EFI in general cleans up the exhaust emissions and because it is more focus able on every change in rpm as can be seen now with CPU controlled fuel supply, offers the possibility of more power, cleaner and more economical use of fuel. Who can argue with that?
Quote from: Royce Peterson on March 28, 2021, 11:20:07 AM
Well the fact is that the Conolec system didn't get used in production by any manufacturer, likely due to a failure of cost versus benefit.
Quote from: shelbydoug on March 28, 2021, 10:42:30 AM
I suspect that the lack of putting the FI into production is circumstantial evidence that the Shelby program was ending or "they" knew it was.
It's actually a pretty good system that should have had more serious consideration for production if not just for the Shelbys.
EFI in general cleans up the exhaust emissions and because it is more focus able on every change in rpm as can be seen now with CPU controlled fuel supply, offers the possibility of more power, cleaner and more economical use of fuel. Who can argue with that?
Yes, absolutely but when you could buy a 428cj equipped anything for $3500, it wasn't cost effective at that point but consider the cost of bringing future vehicles into certification, then it sounds like a bargain.
There have been those who have suggested that sometimes corporations lack foresight? Maybe that's why CEO's get dumped every three years or so now?
It wasn't until the 86 that Ford went to EFI. Cars weren't $3500 anymore and carbs could no longer do what was necessary.
Interesting enough that GM had been playing with "fuelies" for quite a while. Since the 50s.
Ford always seemed to have the "not invented here syndrome" and Conelec wasn't Ford,