Dennis Collins now claims his 67 mustang is 1477 - Dave ?
Watched his video today. Who is this expert he has in the video?
Is that so.....
Link
I haven't had a good laugh this week
So they have gotten lucky and figured out which car their trans is from - lots of holes still.
At 41:26 read the bottom line of the SRG tag. But, in all honesty this guy has done a very deep dive into what was going on at SA in 67 with Ford taking over etc. His reasons behind the Z VINs does make the most sense
From the earlier posts when they were pitching it as 1444
In the earlier discussion the owner related the VIN on the trans was checked with the Registrar and found not to have been from a white car and that the registrar would not share additional information about the car or SA VIN beyond that it was produced later than the sheet metal dates of the mystery car.
The expert is Brian Styles who owns the 67 GT 500 conv. #139
Haven't watched the whole video, is this it ? ?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIj4-HGI6Zk
Wasn't this car discussed here before ?
Maybe I'm mixing it up with #1444 ?
Mike
Quote from: honker on May 27, 2022, 07:31:55 PM
Haven't watched the whole video, is this it ? ?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIj4-HGI6Zk
Wasn't this car discussed here before ?
Maybe I'm mixing it up with #1444 ?
Mike
Yes it was discussed before, here are the other forum threads:
http://www.saacforum.com/index.php?topic=17596.0
(http://www.saacforum.com/index.php?topic=17596.0)
and
http://www.saacforum.com/index.php?topic=6303.0 (http://www.saacforum.com/index.php?topic=6303.0)
Dennis Collins claims a lot of things....... ;)
It would seem they were successful in matching a Ford serial to a Shelby number. Its an interesting story, and its still half a car.
As for the hype on the "Vietnam car", I'm not buying its more significant than the real Bullitt.
Entertaining
Wondering has anyone contacted Mr Styles or anyone in the 1967 Shelby Research Group ?
Quote from: honker on May 27, 2022, 07:31:55 PM
Haven't watched the whole video, is this it ? ?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIj4-HGI6Zk
Wasn't this car discussed here before ?
Maybe I'm mixing it up with #1444 ?
Mike
No it's this one
Watch "Vietnam Fastback, R-Code Mustang, and the Mystery Shelby!" on YouTube
https://youtu.be/TTeXtm9Ouos
The tag on the Vietnam car shows the DSO as 93 which is correct for T5 which was required when a car went to Germany where someone else owned the Mustang copyright.
Earlier discussions on the car indicate it was owned by some General or other higher up I'd say he was probably stationed in Germany when he ordered it but by the time it got built he'd been sent as part of the big buildup that was going on in Vietnam at the time so it got shipped there.
Last sale I found it was in FL without any engine/trans or history beyond "brought back by soldier" .
But we all know how Texans can spin a story - Can Richard Rawlings 68 Convertible be far behind one the gee look what I found list?
you cant make Chicken salad out of Chicken poop! even though the poop came out of a Chicken, it is not a chicken. Dennis Collins has a nice collection of parts bolted and welded on a Mustang Body.. lets hope for his sake he paid accordingly.
Quote from: Coralsnake on May 27, 2022, 08:05:17 PM
It would seem they were successful in matching a Ford serial to a Shelby number. Its an interesting story, and its still half a car.
As for the hype on the "Vietnam car", I'm not buying its more significant than the real Bullitt.
Entertaining
Correct me if I'm wrong here but that's just the transmission they got the vin number from ?
As I recall they kept on throwing parts at it and painted everything to make it look original vs the primer s-box it was. I also remember there were several Shelby mods missing, I'll bet the leaf spring bumpers have magically appeared like the rest of the Shelby parts on the car. Someone is going to get burned.
Can you title a car from just the tranny #s?!?! :o
Question - In the past, has there ever been a SAAC "approved or certified" car which did not have its original VIN? Maybe not the Dennis Collins car ........ but, in general, could a car be approved through SAAC using circumstantial documentation?
SAAC works incredibly hard to ensure accuracy in the chain of custody and integrity of each car. My gut tells me SAAC would NOT certify a car without its original VIN.
Does anyone know of any past examples? Thank you fred
Quote from: Coralsnake on May 27, 2022, 08:05:17 PMits still half a car.
While I am no expert, I am not convinced at this time of the claims being made.
I'll wait for more definitive proof, one way or the other, before further judgement.
Bill
Quote from: rraceme on May 28, 2022, 09:32:59 AMMy gut tells me SAAC would NOT certify a car without its original VIN.
SAAC does not "certify" cars. They will issue you a letter that the Ford VIN you provided and stated is on your car matches the records they have from back in the day. They will not give you info from just a Ford or just a Shelby VIN.
This car is a prime example of fishing. They started with a Ford VIN and a SA # guess. When Dave said - nope wrong color and your sheetmetal dates are too early he let them know they had to go back to the drawing board. They moved onto a new method and searched for the batch of cars where the VIN would fit then looked for a missing car and got lucky. No one has mentioned if the sheetmetal dates would be correct for 1477.
Never forget there are some (said to be 28) "air" Cobras in the registry that were created from the mere fact that the original titles had been surrendered to CA DMV as totaled.
Don't worry Dennis bought the car right - now he's trying to bump the payday with a convoluted tale of ifs and maybes that he'll tell you "proves" it's a 1 of 1 Shelby worth far more than what he's asking for it. Never forget he's first and foremost a car salesman.
Quote from: 557 on May 28, 2022, 02:13:56 AM
Can you title a car from just the tranny #s?!?! :o
good point, no you can't.
Monkey Shines!
This is THEATER, great ACTING, get comfy in your chairs get some popcorn, soda, milk duds, raisinets and watch the show.
Can't wait until "THE OTHER MOVIE" comes out to tge theatre and starts to play "WE FOUND JIMMYS CAR" that's gona be a doooooozieeeeee!
Got Jim's car in my garage.Unfortunately Ca.DMV got vin (and color) wrong when Mr. Morrison registered it.Oh yeah,they got the license plate # wrong as well...Any takers???? :o
Quote from: 557 on May 28, 2022, 01:08:52 PM
Got Jim's car in my garage.Unfortunately Ca.DMV got vin (and color) wrong when Mr. Morrison registered it.Oh yeah,they got the license plate # wrong as well...Any takers???? :o
First thanks for sending me your picture on Jimmys car, the buyer was not at all pleased with it....
Dennis loves to toss the " HOLY GRAIL " phrase onto many of his finds, hoping that will up the ante for potential buyers..and this car will be another. It always amuses me that he has always wanted "one of these" yet immediately puts it up for sale....just wondering Dennis, what is the going rate for HALF OF A HOLY GRAIL ?... ::)
Does anybody remember what happened in Texas that almost got Shelby himself taken down?
All regarding serial numbers and stories.
My good friend C Brown went down and bought some of the dealers inventory and a car or two.
Elenore Mustangs ?
ISN'T there a picture of this 67 race car when it was black in a SAAC topic to refresh memories? maybe page 6, Shelby #1444 one in Chicago race car>> topic header?
If the data that the 67 Registrar has indicates that the sheet metal mfg dates are too early for 1444, then presuming that 1777 is an even newer car, how can the sheet metal dates be about correct for it?
Quote from: shelbydoug on May 28, 2022, 01:35:43 PM
If the data that the 67 Registrar has indicates that the sheet metal mfg dates are too early for 1444, then presuming that 1777 is an even newer car, how can the sheet metal dates be about correct for it?
I think he is claiming 1477, not 1777.
Quote from: A-Snake on May 28, 2022, 01:48:46 PM
Quote from: shelbydoug on May 28, 2022, 01:35:43 PM
If the data that the 67 Registrar has indicates that the sheet metal mfg dates are too early for 1444, then presuming that 1777 is an even newer car, how can the sheet metal dates be about correct for it?
I think he is claiming 1477, not 1777.
Perhaps but one of the pretenses of "management" since time is ultimately limited that a proportional amount should be applied according to importance of the issue?
Times up. See ya'. :)
Quote from: Harris Speedster on May 28, 2022, 01:28:06 PM
Does anybody remember what happened in Texas that almost got Shelby himself taken down?
All regarding serial numbers and stories.
CS was never in danger on that one - he only issued the license to Unique.
Where he got nailed was with the 427 chassis' he "found" in the warehouse. Once DMV learned of the scheme they cancelled all the titles he had gotten issued for the cars. Those serial numbers got blacklisted and can never be street licensed. However all was not lost SA eventually offered the serial numbers on continuation cars with the proviso that they were "off highway" only.
All we need is his business partner Dick Rollins to get involved , give us a WHOO-HOO and play the 1 of 1 card and we would have the trifecta. They were entertaining to watch for awhile but not over and over. Like a broken record it needs to be turned off after it repeats, repeats, repeats, you get the point, some of his cars win the full PINNOCHIO award. Lets wait and see where it goes.
Quote from: Harris Speedster on May 28, 2022, 01:28:06 PMISN'T there a picture of this 67 race car when it was black in a SAAC topic to refresh memories? maybe page 6, Shelby #1444 one in Chicago race car>> topic header?
Believe you may be referring to a series of pictures from the past. Looks like they just removed the primer layer as I think it was mentioned earlier in this thread
Earlier thread location mentioned in the next post
(https://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/17/6-280522220403-174021984.jpeg)
Quote from: shelbydoug on May 28, 2022, 01:35:43 PM
If the data that the 67 Registrar has indicates that the sheet metal mfg dates are too early for 1444, then presuming that 1777 is an even newer car, how can the sheet metal dates be about correct for it?
Don't believe that the Registrar indicated that the
sheet metal dates were too in earlier posts in any of his earlier posts. Could have missed it and maybe someone can find one that does - I would be grateful. Just trying to keep things accurate :) Did his post, shown below, that mentions "characteristics" very different things in my understanding and after doing my fair share of these puzzles
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Re: shelby # 1444 ?, one in chicago, race car
« Reply #23 on: January 08, 2022, 06:36:16 PM »
Quote:
They picked a number out of the Registry in order to sell it. The number they picked has a San Jose date of 3/15/67 and a Shelby completion date of 4/5/67. The characteristics of the rear clip do not match these dates. It was definitely the wrong number.. Unfortunately the buyer did not check with the 67 Registrar. All is not lost if he can find racing history for it. We are hopeful he is successful at finding that history. ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
https://www.saacforum.com/index.php?topic=17596.75 (https://www.saacforum.com/index.php?topic=17596.75)
Quote from: J_Speegle on May 28, 2022, 10:22:05 PM
Quote from: shelbydoug on May 28, 2022, 01:35:43 PM
If the data that the 67 Registrar has indicates that the sheet metal mfg dates are too early for 1444, then presuming that 1777 is an even newer car, how can the sheet metal dates be about correct for it?
Don't believe that the Registrar indicated that the sheet metal dates were too in earlier posts in any of his earlier posts. Could have missed it and maybe someone can find one that does - I would be grateful. Just trying to keep things accurate :) Did his post, shown below, that mentions "characteristics" very different things in my understanding and after doing my fair share of these puzzles
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Re: shelby # 1444 ?, one in chicago, race car
« Reply #23 on: January 08, 2022, 06:36:16 PM »
Quote:
They picked a number out of the Registry in order to sell it. The number they picked has a San Jose date of 3/15/67 and a Shelby completion date of 4/5/67. The characteristics of the rear clip do not match these dates. It was definitely the wrong number.. Unfortunately the buyer did not check with the 67 Registrar. All is not lost if he can find racing history for it. We are hopeful he is successful at finding that history.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
https://www.saacforum.com/index.php?topic=17596.75 (https://www.saacforum.com/index.php?topic=17596.75)
My goof there were a few shots of the sheet metal dates posted that along with "characteristics of the rear clip do not match these dates" and the OP noting that trans was from later car that would not have those characteristics led me to tie it to the date stamp.
https://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/17/6-280522220403-174021984.jpeg
The first problem with this photo is the white paint meets where factory style roof vents would be not Shelby roof scoops - now magically the white paint issue is correct, buyer beware!
Quote from: 427hunter on May 29, 2022, 01:37:43 AM
https://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/17/6-280522220403-174021984.jpeg
The first problem with this photo is the white paint meets where factory style roof vents would be not Shelby roof scoops - now magically the white paint issue is correct, buyer beware!
Not sure why there is red oxide in the picture other than the possibility that whom every removed the black went to far and through the white in that area getting a little carried away. The Shelby scoop hides or covers the complete area where the factory vent cover was on a Mustang. The exterior color didn't typically stop at the edge of the opening (without the scoop or vent cover) but instead the paint was applied over everything there so you wouldn't see red oxide on either a Mustang or Shelby in that area. The louvered vents were not attached when the body or vents were attached to one another No difference in that area of the car.
Basically the same practice as was done to the area for the lower side scoops.
(https://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/17/6-290522042526-174032182.jpeg)
It appears this photo, shown in the video, was taken from the internet.
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/8-290522083624.jpeg)
https://www.barrett-jackson.com/Events/Event/Details/1967-SHELBY-GT350-FASTBACK-43329
It's unfortunate some peoples agendas are getting the better of them.
As a recent former member of that 67 Shelby Facebook group, I can tell you that the Administrator of it indicated to me that the "expert advisor" did look at the sheetmetal dates, compare them to the Ford build date, the Shelby build date and decided that the five week difference was "right in the ballpark for 1444".
He also indicated that the transmission IS original to the car. ;)
He mentioned the intent to stir a debate about the subject, 1444, yet rejected the term of "taking sides" while admitting his non-agreement with mine and Dave's views. Then in a private memo, threatened that if I continued with my "snarky criticisms" he would remove access to the "members thread".
I saved him the effort.
It makes sense that there might be a remote association with TV program hosts here? Many actually think that they know something or can influence the public that they do and we should follow their line of thinking, even after their show is cancelled for poor ratings?
I personally don't adhere to the theory that I can prescribe horse de-worming medications for Covid treatments just because I played a doctor on a TV program?
No. I know better because I stayed in a Holiday Inn last night.
Unfortunately Little Abner and Dogpatch itself hasn't got the electricity yet so they consult with the pigs who I am told are actually highly intelligent? I always thought Arnold Ziffell should run for office. At least the Senate? He probably could win in that state. There are already examples that are in office and have been re-elected several times.
It really shouldn't be that I am categorized as one of the "coastal intellectuals" that don't understand the real America. That really isn't true. I can get down in the mud and wrestle with the pigs too but that doesn't really seem to be the point, just the results.
Calling attention to that '67 Mustang seems counter productive to the owner? It just illustrates to an ever growing group that the thing is basically a pariah and shows that anyone associated with it is as well or should be considered as one?
Interesting the video is not available this morning.
Works fine here. Wish I had the time back that it took to watch it.
Quote from: Coralsnake on May 29, 2022, 08:31:53 AM
Interesting the video is not available this morning.
I shall make another effort , thanks
Quote from: J_Speegle on May 29, 2022, 04:26:03 AM
Quote from: 427hunter on May 29, 2022, 01:37:43 AM
https://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/17/6-280522220403-174021984.jpeg
The first problem with this photo is the white paint meets where factory style roof vents would be not Shelby roof scoops - now magically the white paint issue is correct, buyer beware!
Not sure why there is red oxide in the picture other than the possibility that whom every removed the black went to far and through the white in that area getting a little carried away. The Shelby scoop hides or covers the complete area where the factory vent cover was on a Mustang. The exterior color didn't typically stop at the edge of the opening (without the scoop or vent cover) but instead the paint was applied over everything there so you wouldn't see red oxide on either a Mustang or Shelby in that area. The louvered vents were not attached when the body or vents were attached to one another No difference in that area of the car.
Basically the same practice as was done to the area for the lower side scoops.
(https://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/17/6-290522042526-174032182.jpeg)
Poorly worded on my part, they are faking the distressed white paint all over the car to make it look like a survivor, based on all the faking going on I am not even sure it was a white car. I apricate the photo and the information on the scoop fitment, thanks J!
P.S. I have no dog in the fight, this just looks like they are producing a distressed fake in front of our eyes. If it turn out this is 1477 they cast a big shadow over it with all the fake parts, paint, and B.S.
Quote from: shelbydoug on May 29, 2022, 08:22:22 AM
As a recent former member of that 67 Shelby Facebook group, I can tell you that the Administrator of it indicated to me that the "expert advisor" did look at the sheetmetal dates, compare them to the Ford build date, the Shelby build date and decided that the five week difference was "right in the ballpark for 1444".
He also indicated that the transmission IS original to the car. ;)
He mentioned the intent to stir a debate about the subject, 1444, yet rejected the term of "taking sides" while admitting his non-agreement with mine and Dave's views. Then in a private memo, threatened that if I continued with my "snarky criticisms" he would remove access to the "members thread".
I saved him the effort.
It makes sense that there might be a remote association with TV program hosts here? Many actually think that they know something or can influence the public that they do and we should follow their line of thinking, even after their show is cancelled for poor ratings?
I personally don't adhere to the theory that I can prescribe horse de-worming medications for Covid treatments just because I played a doctor on a TV program?
No. I know better because I stayed in a Holiday Inn last night.
Unfortunately Little Abner and Dogpatch itself hasn't got the electricity yet so they consult with the pigs who I am told are actually highly intelligent? I always thought Arnold Ziffell should run for office. At least the Senate? He probably could win in that state. There are already examples that are in office and have been re-elected several times.
It really shouldn't be that I am categorized as one of the "coastal intellectuals" that don't understand the real America. That really isn't true. I can get down in the mud and wrestle with the pigs too but that doesn't really seem to be the point, just the results.
Calling attention to that '67 Mustang seems counter productive to the owner? It just illustrates to an ever growing group that the thing is basically a pariah and shows that anyone associated with it is as well or should be considered as one?
As with everything else in todays world, healthy debate is only allowed when it fits with a specific narrative. Question that narrative during the healthy debate, and that is when noses get bent out of shape, feathers get ruffled, and threats, idle or otherwise are produced, thus ending the healthy debate. I've had such negative experiences, as I too did not drink the Kool Aid being handed to me in the paper cup. Sad, but true.
Bill
I think we should all get a cup of Coffee and walk away from the Snake oil Dennis is selling here. Bottom line here in my opinion No vin stamped in the car, it's a Holy grail collection of stories and parts. It is however a cool looking old school drag car. I wonder why they replaced the Shelby steering wheel with a J.C. Whitney wood wheel? Probably because it never had one......
When did '67 Shelby's ever have a hood with no scoops or ever fit that right as in the prime red photo?🤔
Quote from: Bill on May 29, 2022, 12:10:01 PM
Quote from: shelbydoug on May 29, 2022, 08:22:22 AM
As a recent former member of that 67 Shelby Facebook group, I can tell you that the Administrator of it indicated to me that the "expert advisor" did look at the sheetmetal dates, compare them to the Ford build date, the Shelby build date and decided that the five week difference was "right in the ballpark for 1444".
He also indicated that the transmission IS original to the car. ;)
He mentioned the intent to stir a debate about the subject, 1444, yet rejected the term of "taking sides" while admitting his non-agreement with mine and Dave's views. Then in a private memo, threatened that if I continued with my "snarky criticisms" he would remove access to the "members thread".
I saved him the effort.
It makes sense that there might be a remote association with TV program hosts here? Many actually think that they know something or can influence the public that they do and we should follow their line of thinking, even after their show is cancelled for poor ratings?
I personally don't adhere to the theory that I can prescribe horse de-worming medications for Covid treatments just because I played a doctor on a TV program?
No. I know better because I stayed in a Holiday Inn last night.
Unfortunately Little Abner and Dogpatch itself hasn't got the electricity yet so they consult with the pigs who I am told are actually highly intelligent? I always thought Arnold Ziffell should run for office. At least the Senate? He probably could win in that state. There are already examples that are in office and have been re-elected several times.
It really shouldn't be that I am categorized as one of the "coastal intellectuals" that don't understand the real America. That really isn't true. I can get down in the mud and wrestle with the pigs too but that doesn't really seem to be the point, just the results.
Calling attention to that '67 Mustang seems counter productive to the owner? It just illustrates to an ever growing group that the thing is basically a pariah and shows that anyone associated with it is as well or should be considered as one?
As with everything else in todays world, healthy debate is only allowed when it fits with a specific narrative. Question that narrative during the healthy debate, and that is when noses get bent out of shape, feathers get ruffled, and threats, idle or otherwise are produced, thus ending the healthy debate. I've had such negative experiences, as I too did not drink the Kool Aid being handed to me in the paper cup. Sad, but true.
Bill
I don't see it as a debate. It is a mono log with only one lecturer. If you disagree with the lecturer, you are censored.
It's not my issue. The car is simply damaged goods few if any will be interested in.
Why draw everyones attention to it at all?
Quote from: shelbydoug on May 29, 2022, 08:48:23 PM
Why draw everyones attention to it at all?
If you say it long enough on the web, and promote it to all of the journalistic parties, then it sooner or later becomes the truth. Worked for Shelby ::)
Bill
Quote from: Bill on May 29, 2022, 09:46:36 PM
Quote from: shelbydoug on May 29, 2022, 08:48:23 PM
Why draw everyones attention to it at all?
If you say it long enough on the web, and promote it to all of the journalistic parties, then it sooner or later becomes the truth. Worked for Shelby ::)
Bill
It didn't work for the SAAC Conspiracy website.... ;D
It didn't work when Shelby "found" all of those unused SC chassis in a "warehouse".
...and all of you driving around in Shelby "continuation" cars that all of which were built for "off road, competition use only (with Goodyear racing tires)"...you're all under arrest. ::)
I wonder just how the Hagerty insurance company would approach placing a policy on this Frankenstein? This is a classic case of an "air car" being created for all the world to see. Like I said previously, it's a cool old drag car. If it was a Shelby Mustang at one time, that was destroyed in an unfortunate accident while at the dealership, then converted into a drag car (as Dennis claims with his numerous photo copies and dead man Facebook copy) that answers all questions right there. when the vin stamped sheet metal and vin tag were cut away and disposed of along with the firewall and radically changing the car forever from a wrecked Shelby Mustang into a Drag car with no identifiable factory Ford vin stamping in the body. It is no longer a Shelby Mustang. Lets discuss another possible theory. Perhaps the car #1477 was destroyed and someone picked parts off the wreck to jazz up the appearance of their drag car? This theory seems more plausible especially given the date code stampings on the body. I can think of three body differences nobody has discussed. I have owned 4 1967 Shelby Mustangs. I have looked at a large number of these cars over the last 20 plus years. I have a challenge for Dennis. (I know you are reading this) Fly me down to Texas. Let me review the car and take me out to dinner afterwards. I will tell you in person just exactly what you have.
Food for thought - every time a nuance factory detail that would have been on the car from the assemblyline is shared on this thread you are giving the builder /owner a better chance of faking it if they are not there already. Especially on a car that already has a few red flags like this one. Prove that you are smart with details some other place but not one that readily gives a possible poser a leg up. Just the way I feel others may feel differently.
Quote from: daltondavid on May 30, 2022, 03:47:45 PM
I wonder just how the Hagerty insurance company would approach placing a policy on this Frankenstein? This is a classic case of an "air car" being created for all the world to see. Like I said previously, it's a cool old drag car. If it was a Shelby Mustang at one time, that was destroyed in an unfortunate accident while at the dealership, then converted into a drag car (as Dennis claims with his numerous photo copies and dead man Facebook copy) that answers all questions right there. when the vin stamped sheet metal and vin tag were cut away and disposed of along with the firewall and radically changing the car forever from a wrecked Shelby Mustang into a Drag car with no identifiable factory Ford vin stamping in the body. It is no longer a Shelby Mustang. Lets discuss another possible theory. Perhaps the car #1477 was destroyed and someone picked parts off the wreck to jazz up the appearance of their drag car? This theory seems more plausible especially given the date code stampings on the body. I can think of three body differences nobody has discussed. I have owned 4 1967 Shelby Mustangs. I have looked at a large number of these cars over the last 20 plus years. I have a challenge for Dennis. (I know you are reading this) Fly me down to Texas. Let me review the car and take me out to dinner afterwards. I will tell you in person just exactly what you have.
The gauntlet has been thrown.....
Quote from: Bob Gaines on May 30, 2022, 05:53:23 PM
Food for thought - every time a nuance factory detail that would have been on the car from the assemblyline is shared on this thread you are giving the builder /owner a better chance of faking it if they are not there already. Especially on a car that already has a few red flags like this one. Prove that you are smart with details some other place but not one that readily gives a possible poser a leg up. Just the way I feel others may feel differently.
+ 1
Quote from: Bob Gaines on May 30, 2022, 05:53:23 PM
Food for thought - every time a nuance factory detail that would have been on the car from the assemblyline is shared on this thread you are giving the builder /owner a better chance of faking it if they are not there already. ...................
+1
Something we've mentioned numerous times in other threads but a good reminder about public discussions and disclosures here and on other sites
Quote from: Bob Gaines on May 30, 2022, 05:53:23 PMFood for thought - every time a nuance factory detail that would have been on the car from the assemblyline is shared on this thread you are giving the builder /owner a better chance of faking it if they are not there already.
You're not far off - take a look at the first pictures when "discovered" and what it is today. So far the only thing that has been proven is paperwork exists that a 1967 GT350 with a 4 speed was built and sold by Shelby American. There has been nothing offered/proven to link this collection of sheetmetal to Shelby American. I'd think a LARGE part of their claim when the SA tag is gone would be showing that trans VIN and not blocking the Ford VIN on the Marti report. Of course once that number gets out you may find the real wreckage tucked away in a garage where the original owner has kept it since buying his 427 Cobra back from the insurance company. That one car blew they whole lid off the Air Cobra business.
Quote from: 98SVT - was 06GT on May 30, 2022, 09:37:44 PM
.................I'd think a LARGE part of their claim when the SA tag is gone would be showing that trans VIN and not blocking the Ford VIN on the Marti report.............
It was already "disclosed" in the
first video that they didn't claim the transmission VIN match the cars VIN . The speaker had his own reasoning or excuse but he was incorrect about allot of things he stated in that video at about the 19:42 minute mark if you want to listen to that
Quote from: J_Speegle on May 30, 2022, 09:47:22 PM
Quote from: 98SVT - was 06GT on May 30, 2022, 09:37:44 PM
.................I'd think a LARGE part of their claim when the SA tag is gone would be showing that trans VIN and not blocking the Ford VIN on the Marti report.............
It was already "disclosed" in the first video that they didn't claim the transmission VIN match the cars VIN . The speaker had his own reasoning or excuse but he was incorrect about allot of things he stated in that video at about the 19:42 minute mark if you want to listen to that
Now all we need is people with close Ford VINs on either side to point out the sheet metal differences. SA VIN won't work since they weren't built in order.
Who is Dennis Collins? Never heard of the person.
Quote from: 98SVT - was 06GT on May 30, 2022, 10:39:58 PM
Now all we need is people with close Ford VINs on either side to point out the sheet metal differences. SA VIN won't work since they weren't built in order.
There is even a better way than what your suggesting, but by providing that would also go to help others interested, possibly, in making their own fake, copy and air car. Would also offer that Ford didn't build the cars in VIN order either ;)
Fair amount of data has already been collected over the last couple decades or more.
The Marti Report, with the Ford VIN, was only partially blocked. Here is a screen shot.
Also, the stamped VIN from the toploader, was shown in the first video around 19:44. Everyone should go look, and draw your own conclusion. Someone gets an E for effort, that is all that I am going to say.
.
Was there any mention of a cutout/knockout in the LH upper corner of the rad support for the Paxton?
And Voltage Regulator screw holes on the left front apron, unless that apron was completely removed?
There is no radiator support. There are no inner fender aprons, no shock towers, no firewall, no front frame rails , no floor, no doors, no original fiberglass, no door window glass, no windshield, no engine.
No serial numbers, no title.
:o
In the video with Brian Stiles, Dennis flashes a blow up of a photo showing kids and a dog. in the background is 3 cars. One appears to be a 67 Shelby with LeMans stripes. He claims that is this car. Yet this drag car has Super Snake stripes ( wide center with thin sides ) over top.
Someone in the comments section for the first video claims to have sold the previous owner the leaf springs.
Is not the standard extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof?
Quote from: Coralsnake on May 31, 2022, 07:03:22 AM
There is no radiator support. There are no inner fender aprons, no shock towers, no firewall, no front frame rails , no floor, no doors, no original fiberglass, no door window glass, no windshield, no engine.
No serial numbers, no title.
:o
^^^ =
"no Shelby" ?? ??? ::)
Quote from: stephen_becker on May 30, 2022, 11:06:53 PM
Who is Dennis Collins? Never heard of the person.
Jeep dealer in Texas with more money than brains. He was the money behind Gas Monkey garage and Richard Rawlings.
I've sat back and kept quiet for a couple years and listened to all of the conspiracy theories and bashing from so many, including some of you guys....
To the ones who helped me and we're supportive, I thank you very much. Every email and text helped me to get one step closer to solving the cars origin (1477).
Truth be told, When I first discovered this car and brought it home to Detroit from Chicago,, I found the transmission VIN stamp which was caked in grease & dirt. I immediately contacted Dave Mathews that day with as found car pictures and also with the VIN sequence (from the trans).
He knowingly mislead me as to the true identity of the transmission was. His words were that it was from a late '67 build and that it was from a Green GT350. Stated that all I had was a Old cut up Mustang.
Also, to add to his dishonesty, he fabricated a long story of how the green car had been stolen and recovered minus the driveline. He advised me that I'd be best for me to remain silent about the car and the transmission because it could "open up a can of worms".
He warned me that I could be opening myself up to legality issues because of the stolen status of the transmission..... I have all of the original emails and conversations to back up everything I've said for anyone wanting to doubt me.
Also, for the doubters... reread my original posts regarding the car, the date codes that I shared and also the additional part and panel stamps DO in fact match with the 1477 build dates. It's very easy to sit back and throw stones when you haven't seen the car in person. There have now been respected and knowledgeable Shelby experts who agree as to the cars true origin. (1477)
Had he been honest from the start, this could have been an amazing find for the SAAC group as I came here to you guys first for help. I laid every piece of data out there for you openly and honestly.
Unfortunately for myself, We sold the car at an exact break even amount and it quiet honestly wasn't much at all. Trust me. My cousin and myself wanted the car to go to someone who had the horsepower to take it to the next level, and hopefully someone with the ability to treat this car with the respect it deserves. I no longer own the car, so I have zero to gain by stating the facts. I'm not angry at Dave or the group, just extremely disappointed in how things were handled.
As owners and caretakers of such a rare brand, I feel that it's your duty & obligation to try and find the true history of existing and also missing units when they come to light. I know that the car was butchered, but had you taken the time to help, rather than bash my attempts, this could have been a completely different outcome.
So this post will most likely get taken down and deleted very soon because it states some facts that some will find offensive, but I'm posting the facts as they happened. I feel that the group deserves to hear how Dave handled this situation. I completely understand the concept of protecting the breed from fishing expeditions to match VIN's, but this was blatant. I now wish that I had posted the trans numbers from the start.
Quote from: Thomas on June 01, 2022, 07:30:34 AM
I've sat back and kept quiet for a couple years and listened to all of the conspiracy theories and bashing from so many, including some of you guys....
To the ones who helped me and we're supportive, I thank you very much. Every email and text helped me to get one step closer to solving the cars origin (1477).
Truth be told, When I first discovered this car and brought it home to Detroit from Chicago,, I found the transmission VIN stamp which was caked in grease & dirt. I immediately contacted Dave Mathews that day with as found car pictures and also with the VIN sequence (from the trans).
He knowingly mislead me as to the true identity of the transmission was. His words were that it was from a late '67 build and that it was from a Green GT350. Stated that all I had was a Old cut up Mustang.
Also, to add to his dishonesty, he fabricated a long story of how the green car had been stolen and recovered minus the driveline. He advised me that I'd be best for me to remain silent about the car and the transmission because it could "open up a can of worms".
He warned me that I could be opening myself up to legality issues because of the stolen status of the transmission..... I have all of the original emails and conversations to back up everything I've said for anyone wanting to doubt me.
Also, for the doubters... reread my original posts regarding the car, the date codes that I shared and also the additional part and panel stamps DO in fact match with the 1477 build dates. It's very easy to sit back and throw stones when you haven't seen the car in person. There have now been respected and knowledgeable Shelby experts who agree as to the cars true origin. (1477)
Had he been honest from the start, this could have been an amazing find for the SAAC group as I came here to you guys first for help. I laid every piece of data out there for you openly and honestly.
Unfortunately for myself, We sold the car at an exact break even amount and it quiet honestly wasn't much at all. Trust me. My cousin and myself wanted the car to go to someone who had the horsepower to take it to the next level, and hopefully someone with the ability to treat this car with the respect it deserves. I no longer own the car, so I have zero to gain by stating the facts. I'm not angry at Dave or the group, just extremely disappointed in how things were handled.
As owners and caretakers of such a rare brand, I feel that it's your duty & obligation to try and find the true history of existing and also missing units when they come to light. I know that the car was butchered, but had you taken the time to help, rather than bash my attempts, this could have been a completely different outcome.
So this post will most likely get taken down and deleted very soon because it states some facts that some will find offensive, but I'm posting the facts as they happened. I feel that the group deserves to hear how Dave handled this situation. I completely understand the concept of protecting the breed from fishing expeditions to match VIN's, but this was blatant. I now wish that I had posted the trans numbers from the start.
Thomas,
While I am not taking sides other than to say the car is still in question, regardless of who "the shelby experts" are who saw the car, and are now hyping the car as one or another for their own personal gain. In addition, bold statements require cold, hard facts to back them up.
I wish you well, and will leave it at that.
Bill
Bill,
The question of the car's authenticity is not what this post was about. That burden falls squarely on Dennis's shoulders now as he is the new advocate for the car.
My post was only to clear the air on a couple points....
I'm leaving it at that. I plan on no further involvement with the situation.
I also wish you the best and I truly hope that the situation with the car works out to be an incredible story.
Quote from: Coralsnake on May 31, 2022, 07:03:22 AM
There is no radiator support. There are no inner fender aprons, no shock towers, no firewall, no front frame rails , no floor, no doors, no original fiberglass, no door window glass, no windshield, no engine.
No serial numbers, no title.
:o
good points Pete.......But its a real shelby....good luck with that one
Thomas, I believe your motivations are generally coming from an honest place.
Here is the issue as I see it. You are dealing with a group of people that have a lot of collective knowledge. When you make inaccurate statements and change the vehicle to fit your narrative, you are not doing yourself any favors.
You may be correct in your assumptions. Unfortunately, you are really fighting a losing battle.
Thomas..
I gotta jump in....
I have long history with SAAC and with Dave Mathews.
Dave has been a real asset to the club and has been devoted to his responsibilities as a registrar.
It's upsetting to read that he "mislead you" about your transmission and your car and he did it purposely.
He would never do that or compromise his reputation.
Also, I know Dennis Collins.
I've purchased a couple Shelby's from him.
He's been upfront and honest about cars he offered me.
I'm not taking sides on this issue...
I don't know your car.
But I thought I should mention that I know both Dave and Dennis.
And they've both been a pleasure to know.
In this world I think we need to stand up for people and their reputation from time to time.
That's all I'm doing..
Bret Matteson
Bret,
Unfortunately he would, and he did exactly that.
Hi Thomas,
I also have copies of all our correspondence and photos of the car when you purchased it. We went through the normal steps we go through to determine what you had. The rear Mustang clip was basically all that was left of the original car. There were some characteristics that led myself and others at the time to believe it was a clip from a Shelby.
SAAC's position, which was created over 30 years ago is we validate 1967 Shelby Mustangs from Ford Vin. chassis stampings. The front of this car no longer exists so it has no chassis stampings. SAAC does not recognize cars built from bolt on components like a transmission. If that were ever to occur, we would have all kinds of people claiming cars that no longer exist. Without chassis numbers, there is nothing further that SAAC can offer. This position was not well received.
The problem with this car is the people who were involved with it prior to Dennis altered it in an attempt to turn it into something it wasn't, most likely for the purpose of sale.
I think the car is a cool old race car and it's secrets are really in it's history as a race car. Hopefully the efforts to make it into a Shelby haven't covered up or altered any information that would relate to that.
Dave
Quote from: Thomas on June 01, 2022, 08:35:24 AM
Bret,
Unfortunately he would, and he did exactly that.
Cheap shot Thomas. NO ONE intentionally did ANYTHING to you. You just don't like the way the narrative is going against YOUR interpretation.
In the world of psychology, you have what some would describe as a self reinforcing delusion.
The door is always open for you to leave. I'm sure that you will and sure that you will be back when there is something that you need us for?
Quote from: Thomas on June 01, 2022, 07:30:34 AM
I've sat back and kept quiet for a couple years and listened to all of the conspiracy theories and bashing from so many, including some of you guys....
To the ones who helped me and we're supportive, I thank you very much. Every email and text helped me to get one step closer to solving the cars origin (1477).
Truth be told, When I first discovered this car and brought it home to Detroit from Chicago,, I found the transmission VIN stamp which was caked in grease & dirt. I immediately contacted Dave Mathews that day with as found car pictures and also with the VIN sequence (from the trans).
He knowingly mislead me as to the true identity of the transmission was. His words were that it was from a late '67 build and that it was from a Green GT350. Stated that all I had was a Old cut up Mustang.
Also, to add to his dishonesty, he fabricated a long story of how the green car had been stolen and recovered minus the driveline. He advised me that I'd be best for me to remain silent about the car and the transmission because it could "open up a can of worms".
He warned me that I could be opening myself up to legality issues because of the stolen status of the transmission..... I have all of the original emails and conversations to back up everything I've said for anyone wanting to doubt me.
Also, for the doubters... reread my original posts regarding the car, the date codes that I shared and also the additional part and panel stamps DO in fact match with the 1477 build dates. It's very easy to sit back and throw stones when you haven't seen the car in person. There have now been respected and knowledgeable Shelby experts who agree as to the cars true origin. (1477)
Had he been honest from the start, this could have been an amazing find for the SAAC group as I came here to you guys first for help. I laid every piece of data out there for you openly and honestly.
Unfortunately for myself, We sold the car at an exact break even amount and it quiet honestly wasn't much at all. Trust me. My cousin and myself wanted the car to go to someone who had the horsepower to take it to the next level, and hopefully someone with the ability to treat this car with the respect it deserves. I no longer own the car, so I have zero to gain by stating the facts. I'm not angry at Dave or the group, just extremely disappointed in how things were handled.
As owners and caretakers of such a rare brand, I feel that it's your duty & obligation to try and find the true history of existing and also missing units when they come to light. I know that the car was butchered, but had you taken the time to help, rather than bash my attempts, this could have been a completely different outcome.
So this post will most likely get taken down and deleted very soon because it states some facts that some will find offensive, but I'm posting the facts as they happened. I feel that the group deserves to hear how Dave handled this situation. I completely understand the concept of protecting the breed from fishing expeditions to match VIN's, but this was blatant. I now wish that I had posted the trans numbers from the start.
So you are saying you did not buy parts from different people and fake the car to look like a survivor shelby?
Having a Shelby transmission does not make the car a shelby, but since you are hear and claiming Dave misled you, what are the sheet metal dates? show us the construction differences from San Jose.
Ball is in your court, all the evidence we have at this point is you threw a bunch of parts at a mustang race car from a non existent class and made it look like a 67 shelby: oh and if the stamp is real a transmission from 1477.
You both need help.
No cheap shots and nothing delusional when the facts as stated are 100% true.
I gain not a single thing, not one dime by telling the truth in this matter.
The car is real, you will all be eating crow when the process of inspection is finished...
Dave & I both know what was said and what happened... I have nothing else to say on the matter.
All the best gentlemen...
Truth be told, When I first discovered this car and brought it home to Detroit from Chicago,, I found the transmission VIN stamp which was caked in grease & dirt. I immediately contacted Dave Mathews that day with as found car pictures and also with the VIN sequence (from the trans).
My question why not Marti first? You had a Ford number not a Shelby number. Seems like you were hoping Shelby and going after that narrative from the start.
Without the front clip "the process of inspection" can't even begin much less come to a conclusion in an LAX hanger.
Quote from: Thomas on June 01, 2022, 11:41:42 AM
You both need help.
No cheap shots and nothing delusional when the facts as stated are 100% true.
I gain not a single thing, not one dime by telling the truth in this matter.
The car is real, you will all be eating crow when the process of inspection is finished...
Dave & I both know what was said and what happened... I have nothing else to say on the matter.
All the best gentlemen...
You really can't just answer two question?
Did you buy parts from different people to make the car to look like a survivor shelby?
What are the sheet metal dates?
https://www.facebook.com/343470002343007/posts/5575263239163631/?sfnsn=mo
https://www.motortrend.com/features/missing-mustangs-an-afx-1967-shelby-gt-350-with-amnesia/?fbclid=IwAR3fzbXAjW_Ut9WVLNh_kGmDQAxxtyYzRcMd4BNaFdQ7c_T3JLweFda_EHE (https://www.motortrend.com/features/missing-mustangs-an-afx-1967-shelby-gt-350-with-amnesia/?fbclid=IwAR3fzbXAjW_Ut9WVLNh_kGmDQAxxtyYzRcMd4BNaFdQ7c_T3JLweFda_EHE)
Quote from: silverton_ford on June 01, 2022, 12:29:51 PM
https://www.motortrend.com/features/missing-mustangs-an-afx-1967-shelby-gt-350-with-amnesia/?fbclid=IwAR3fzbXAjW_Ut9WVLNh_kGmDQAxxtyYzRcMd4BNaFdQ7c_T3JLweFda_EHE (https://www.motortrend.com/features/missing-mustangs-an-afx-1967-shelby-gt-350-with-amnesia/?fbclid=IwAR3fzbXAjW_Ut9WVLNh_kGmDQAxxtyYzRcMd4BNaFdQ7c_T3JLweFda_EHE)
Out of the whole article, I find the following quote to be interesting:
"Thomas is putting out an APB on the history of his Mustang. Due to the fact that the front apron has been removed for the straight axle, we're left with no Shelby VIN to confirm the car. Thomas brought in both Randy DeLisio and Dave Mathews, both 1967 Shelby historians, who confirmed the shell is in fact a 1967 Shelby, but which exact Shelby (of the 1,174 cars built) remains a mystery."
Bill
Quote from: Bill on June 01, 2022, 01:07:03 PM....... both Randy DeLisio and Dave Mathews, both 1967 Shelby historians, who confirmed the shell is in fact a 1967 Shelby,
I'd say Dave Mathews has a big payday coming. Pretty sure he only confirmed that the Ford number on the trans matched one of the cars sent to Shelby American - not that it was this shell.
BS begins at about the 24:40 minute mark. Be sure you have your boots on before watching. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2OhH_mYzVMg
Quote from: FL SAAC on June 01, 2022, 11:54:57 AM
https://www.facebook.com/343470002343007/posts/5575263239163631/?sfnsn=mo
I see the FakeBook experts have signed on to it's long time SA history - even though it's only months old.
It just amazes me how these snowflakes just appear out of nowhere and just as suddenly disappear in the sunlight.
Quote from: A-Snake on June 01, 2022, 02:13:51 PM
BS begins at about the 24:40 minute mark. Be sure you have your boots on before watching. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2OhH_mYzVMg
Boots, You mean hip wader's! Oh and the smell!
Quote from: 98SVT - was 06GT on June 01, 2022, 02:07:48 PM
Quote from: Bill on June 01, 2022, 01:07:03 PM....... both Randy DeLisio and Dave Mathews, both 1967 Shelby historians, who confirmed the shell is in fact a 1967 Shelby,
I'd say Dave Mathews has a big payday coming. Pretty sure he only confirmed that the Ford number on the trans matched one of the cars sent to Shelby American - not that it was this shell.
Can anyone say, defamation of character lawsuit
Roy
Quote from: 98SVT - was 06GT on June 01, 2022, 02:14:28 PM
Quote from: FL SAAC on June 01, 2022, 11:54:57 AM
https://www.facebook.com/343470002343007/posts/5575263239163631/?sfnsn=mo
I see the FakeBook experts have signed on to it's long time SA history - even though it's only months old.
There was another thread on a vintage Ford page where the car was heavilly de-bunked. I was one of the nay-sayers asking for the truth. I even called out since the car has no VIN or title, you could call it anything you want, including an Impala. But, just like this new thread, too many new experts. The thread that I had posted on was completely removed. I guess the original poster did not like the truth.
Got my boots on and was slowly sinking...until Dennis said that people stated that the Vietnam Car was cooler than the Bulitt Mustang..(glub, glub).... :o
Quote from: Wedgeman on June 01, 2022, 07:18:28 PM
Got my boots on and was slowly sinking...until Dennis said that people stated that the Vietnam Car was cooler than the Bulitt Mustang..(glub, glub).... :o
When Dennis and Richard take a beer walk you can expect a tidal wave of BS
Kinda surprised that Richard didn't know what the brake duct hose in the rear side scoop was for.
Quote from: Side-Oilers on June 01, 2022, 08:15:59 PM
Kinda surprised that Richard didn't know what the brake duct hose in the rear side scoop was for.
He'd figure it was to blow the tire smoke out of the wheel well for a bigger plume.
Or a driver relief tube. The hose just needs to be routed to the driver's seat.
Must be nice to own a Shelby transmission.Much nicer to own an actual Shelby though..... 8)
I think we should all give Dennis and Richard an opportunity to review what they have heard and what they have seen and digest it for a bit. Their reputations in this hobby is something they have spent years developing and I am certain they are in no hurry to damage it over a tired old Race car they can certainly turn a profit on as it is. When you play baseball you cannot hit a home run everytime you are up to bat. But a base hit will always keep you in the game. And that's what this car is. Dennis Collins "Coffee Walk" on you tube should get a boost in views as should Richard Rawlings "Gas monkey Garage" also seen on You tube.
While the car may well be the remnants of 1477, there is still a significant amount of paint removal to show its the same as the photos he was flashing. With that (and more) will he really be able to estimate how much is remnant. Old race cars are the hardest to prove origins.
Lets play devil's advocate
He has part of 1477. There is no paperwork or serial number. These are facts.
If you take the leap and create either, I think that's illegal and you are taking a chance another version of the car doesn't exist or show up.
You can have a serial number on your vehicle, but you just cant take one you don't have.
Because, if you bet the farm and you're wrong...
Yup!
Quote from: Bill on May 29, 2022, 09:46:36 PM
Quote from: shelbydoug on May 29, 2022, 08:48:23 PM
Why draw everyones attention to it at all?
If you say it long enough on the web, and promote it to all of the journalistic parties, then it sooner or later becomes the truth. Worked for Shelby ::)
Bill
It also has worked for a certain 1 of 1 69 "Shelby" GT350... ;) ;) ;)
Quote from: Coralsnake on June 02, 2022, 07:45:50 AM
Lets play devil's advocate
He has part of 1477. There is no paperwork or serial number. These are facts.
If you take the leap and create either, I think that's illegal and you are taking a chance another version of the car doesn't exist or show up.
You can have a serial number on your vehicle, but you just cant take one you don't have.
Because, if you bet the farm and you're wrong...
Pete: I looked at a 67 Shelby awhile back and finally convinced the guy to take off the tag.
It was a nice 67 clone but it was a C Code Mustang.
The seller was still convinced it was a real car.
Finally, I looked at him and his wife and told him "if you sell this as a GT 350 about four months from now you'll get a registered letter in the mail and then a court date". I told them that I'm not the Shelby police but they're opening themselves up to a major problem down the road.
Soon after they changed their description.
Bret
I don't wish to be the police either, just sharing what I have learned over the past few decades.
It amazes me how many people are oblivious to the facts and can't apply some very basic information.
Quote from: Coralsnake on June 02, 2022, 07:45:50 AMHe has part of 1477. There is no paperwork or serial number. These are facts.
I'd clean that statement up to read he has the transmission from 1477. Anything more and he'll be adding you to his list of experts who have confirmed it's "the car".
For those of us that have read the new 2022 registry from front to back, this seems to be an asterisk car. Now forever to have the explanation that there is no Vined numbered sheet metal, and out of date (so I read) sheet metal with the known Ford and Shelby completion date. Possible air car/rebody. What would that be worth?
There are other cars in the registry with similar descriptions.
Quote from: roddster on June 02, 2022, 02:16:51 PM
For those of us that have read the new 2022 registry from front to back, this seems to be an asterisk car. Now forever to have the explanation that there is no Vined numbered sheet metal, and out of date (so I read) sheet metal with the known Ford and Shelby completion date. Possible air car/rebody. What would that be worth?
There are other cars in the registry with similar descriptions.
It should only be in the registry as - UNKNOWN. Possible air/rebody would only apply if someone sends in acceptable ownership information. The other cars with similar descriptions were registered by owners whose cars history of rusty/crashed and rebuilt is known and/or they don't have the Ford VIN. The registrars records will note that the transmission was located.
When myself and a few others first started this forum, under the heading I recall was the following statement: "The undisputed authority on the cars produced by Shelby American from 1962-1970". It was a phrase Created to remind the World that Carroll Shelby himself entrusted Rick Kopec and SAAC with the historical records and knowledge to proceed with high moral standards and act as the Guardians of this information. I have personally witnessed SAAC HQ and the men who operate as registrars. They are as genuine as it gets and the system and process involved regarding the information of these cars is second to none. They are The SHELBY EXPERTS. The Supreme Court of SHELBY so to speak. SAAC and its Registrars subsequent opinions and determinations of any situation regarding these cars is the final say. That's it and that's all. Now go get ya some of that!
Quote from: daltondavid on June 02, 2022, 07:01:22 PM
When myself and a few others first started this forum, under the heading I recall was the following statement: "The undisputed authority on the cars produced by Shelby American from 1962-1970". It was a phrase Created to remind the World that Carroll Shelby himself entrusted Rick Kopec and SAAC with the historical records and knowledge to proceed with high moral standards and act as the Guardians of this information. I have personally witnessed SAAC HQ and the men who operate as registrars. They are as genuine as it gets and the system and process involved regarding the information of these cars is second to none. They are The SHELBY EXPERTS. The Supreme Court of SHELBY so to speak. SAAC and its Registrars subsequent opinions and determinations of any situation regarding these cars is the final say. That's it and that's all. Now go get ya some of that!
+1
Quote from: Cobrask8 on June 01, 2022, 05:42:35 PM
Quote from: 98SVT - was 06GT on June 01, 2022, 02:14:28 PM
Quote from: FL SAAC on June 01, 2022, 11:54:57 AM
https://www.facebook.com/343470002343007/posts/5575263239163631/?sfnsn=mo
I see the FakeBook experts have signed on to it's long time SA history - even though it's only months old.
There was another thread on a vintage Ford page where the car was heavilly de-bunked. I was one of the nay-sayers asking for the truth. I even called out since the car has no VIN or title, you could call it anything you want, including an Impala. But, just like this new thread, too many new experts. The thread that I had posted on was completely removed. I guess the original poster did not like the truth.
Let's make it a 409/409!
Quote from: Thomas on June 01, 2022, 11:41:42 AM
You both need help.
No cheap shots and nothing delusional when the facts as stated are 100% true.
I gain not a single thing, not one dime by telling the truth in this matter.
The car is real, you will all be eating crow when the process of inspection is finished...
Dave & I both know what was said and what happened... I have nothing else to say on the matter.
All the best gentlemen...
Calling out Dave who we all know is brutally honest....
Best of luck.
Google will be the best friend of who ever ends up with this thing called 1477
In the eyes of the law the Lawyers like to focus on the tip of the spear... Truth and what was the intent here. Watching the video the seller says non Shalantly its not about the money. Thats the full Pinnochio and goes down hill from there. In guessing how much Dennis payed for it , that would probably be more then a 40-50 k fastback Drag car we are looking at. Dennis mentions in a video to his partner Richard... Do you know how much a Paxton car just sold for? (700k )That is where he was going with this, on the purchase it appears. Finding a car that fit this narrative, took time and thought. It was a gamble he was willing to take but the SHELBY EXPERTS shut that thought process down. Hopefully the Gas Monkey / Jeep parts people will come on here to join in on where this is going, to return their credibility as car people and prevent this from going down the rabbit hole any further!
Quote from: daltondavid on June 02, 2022, 07:01:22 PM
When myself and a few others first started this forum, under the heading I recall was the following statement: "The undisputed authority on the cars produced by Shelby American from 1962-1970". It was a phrase Created to remind the World that Carroll Shelby himself entrusted Rick Kopec and SAAC with the historical records and knowledge to proceed with high moral standards and act as the Guardians of this information. I have personally witnessed SAAC HQ and the men who operate as registrars. They are as genuine as it gets and the system and process involved regarding the information of these cars is second to none. They are The SHELBY EXPERTS. The Supreme Court of SHELBY so to speak. SAAC and its Registrars subsequent opinions and determinations of any situation regarding these cars is the final say. That's it and that's all. Now go get ya some of that!
I would expect that the "Registry conspiracy" theory will be reemerging soon with possibly a new twist?
No one associated with SAAC long term is shocked by ass holes like QAnon. We've been dealing with disillusioned crap like that since the beginning. Granted there can be an initial amazement but you will realize eventually that the dog was peeing on your foot, it was not rain, and now your sneaker smells like dog piss?
I personally just deal with it as entertainment but frankly it wouldn't even make a TV program that would last 1/2 a season without being cancelled.
Interesting though that there are people involved that are involved with TV programing? Is that a conspiracy theory from me? ???
"You're Still Here? It's Over. Go Home." — Ferris.
Qoute from the film "Ferris Bhueller Day Off" when he finds out that they are still talking about this car......
Unfortunately the forum is not capable of a healthy discussion
( "Expand your mind be more open, there is more to life than mustangs or pieces of mustangs" ) ======= Wow, we see that every day , LOL
Where is the original post that I got that comment from ????? Think before you post next time, it's not all about the numbers :P
Quote from: Coralsnake on June 03, 2022, 10:12:50 AM
Unfortunately the forum is not capable of a healthy discussion
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D But it should be.
Quote from: daltondavid on June 03, 2022, 05:52:13 PM
Quote from: Coralsnake on June 03, 2022, 10:12:50 AM
Unfortunately the forum is not capable of a healthy discussion
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D But it should be.
Wurd
I agree with all of the above statements, let me add usually there is no sign of life, imagination or humor.
Moving right along and keeping with the topic at hand has anyone heard any new developments on this vehicle today ?
And as always thank you for your time
Quote from: FL SAAC on June 03, 2022, 08:23:10 PM...... keeping with the topic at hand has anyone heard any new developments on this vehicle today ?
Pookie has sold them some NOS parts that were found in the trunk of 1477 after the crash.
Quote from: 98SVT - was 06GT on June 03, 2022, 09:45:21 PM
Pookie has sold them some NOS parts that were found in the trunk of 1477 after the crash.
^^^ that's funny - thanks for the laugh ;-)
Would look good as a 66.
It is now a factory Paxton car.
New video dropped recently.
GT350 dialogue starts around 18 minutes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TTeXtm9Ouos
Once you tell a WHOPPER then that opens the door for many more WHOPPERS. :-[
If you tell a lie enough times to the sheep they eventually all fall into place, No matter what you are talking about or selling.
Another good example is the current state of affairs in the good ole USA, its a tragedy........ :'(
No offense taken. 😉
This sheep dung all the way and the people associated with it are stained.
how about his 69 gt 350 fb that was black? since only 2 were built, what would be the odds? (black, not black jade) and in the veiws, it was code a black. scoops
Quote from: papa scoops on June 05, 2022, 07:45:44 PM
how about his 69 gt 350 fb that was black? since only 2 were built, what would be the odds? (black, not black jade) and in the veiws, it was code a black. scoops
Are you saying 2 69 GT350s were painted black (A) or was Dennis? I haven't gone through the registry car by car but I thought Tony King's prototype 69 Gt500 vert was the only black built 69(70) Shelby?
Quote from: shelbymann1970 on June 06, 2022, 06:18:44 AM
Quote from: papa scoops on June 05, 2022, 07:45:44 PM
how about his 69 gt 350 fb that was black? since only 2 were built, what would be the odds? (black, not black jade) and in the veiws, it was code a black. scoops
Are you saying 2 69 GT350s were painted black (A) or was Dennis? I haven't gone through the registry car by car but I thought Tony King's prototype 69 Gt500 vert was the only black built 69(70) Shelby?
Tom Caldera's '69 GT350 is an original black 4 speed. It got rearended somewhere in the early '70s and at that point Tom went full custom on it.
At that time he was still "partners" with Nazy Nate Cohen who was a 427 Thunderbolt guy along with other 427 Fords.
He went with "Sundance" with a full street rod interior and tubed the rear, but unless he had repainted the car black by the time I knew it, 1971-2, then it was originally a black car.
I believe only two black cars. One preproduction convertible and one fastback. The fastback was also preproduction car that was repainted to red. Both were big blocks.
No production "A" color codes
http://www.thecoralsnake.com/1969Protos
Quote from: Coralsnake on June 06, 2022, 08:51:59 AM
I believe only two black cars. One preproduction convertible and one fastback. The fastback was also preproduction car that was repainted to red. Both were big blocks.
No production "A" color codes
http://www.thecoralsnake.com/1969Protos
Thanks Pete for your link. I do not know how I missed the other black car. Great research as always on your part.
Well obviously Dennis and Richard are not joining the conversation and we are drifting off topic.....
Has anyone seen the new coffee walk episode last week, nothing was said on this vehicle ?
We thought that on episode #201 they were suposse to reveal the provenance and all the history on this particular vehicle
Quote from: daltondavid on June 06, 2022, 03:26:34 PM
Well obviously Dennis and Richard are not joining the conversation and we are drifting off topic.....
David,
My thoughts on this are simple, if they do not join in to the conversation, they can then use "plausible deniability" down the road, should they choose to restore the car under xxxx's VIN, sell it, and then the real "xxxx" comes out of the woodwork from it's potentially deep, dark, cold storage. I see so many potential problems, on a civil, state, and federal level if that scenario ever plays out in real life.
Bill
FL SAAC
Episode 200 is where the provenance is revealed. Starts around 18 minutes in.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TTeXtm9Ouos
Quote from: rmarble57 on June 06, 2022, 05:09:05 PM
FL SAAC
Episode 200 is where the provenance is revealed. Starts around 18 minutes in.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TTeXtm9Ouos
prov·e·nance -
a record of ownership of a work of art or an antique, used as a guide to authenticity or quality.
Looks like we're missing some records. Their "expert" knows paperwork not the sheetmetal. Where is their well known certified 1967 Mustang concourse judge pointing out all the differences that are on a 67 sent to SA vs ones from other assembly plants?
It's funny how some really good Shelbys have the stigma of missing their original Shelby VIN tags and take abuse over it. Here we have a car that not only is missing it's tag, it's missing EVERYTHING! This car could very likely be the remnants of car 1477, but it's analogous to when folks take all the Shelby parts off a wrecked car and stick em on a '67 Mustang. If someone pays big money for this under the premise that its a long lost '67 Paxton car, than they have been truly Gas Monkey F'd in my opinion. Sad, if these cars weren't worth a tenth the value they bring, you wouldn't see shenanigans like this.
Hmm looks like they are trying to sell the story.
Pause for a little bit guys because I've run out of popcorn and need to make a quick run to the store for more. Got plenty of beer though. 🍺
Roy
Jim Morrison's is next. Someone at Carlisle said it's turned up and and the auto archeologists guy's are doing a show on it! Maybe Dennis has found it! ;)
Quote from: tonys_shelby on June 06, 2022, 07:22:59 PM
Jim Morrison's is next. Someone at Carlisle said it's turned up and and the auto archeologists guy's are doing a show on it! Maybe Dennis has found it! ;)
Please see reply # 20 on this thread:
Can't wait until "THE OTHER MOVIE" comes out to the theatre and starts to play "WE FOUND JIMMYS CAR" that's gona be a doooooozieeeeee!
Quote from: tonys_shelby on June 06, 2022, 07:22:59 PM
Jim Morrison's is next. Someone at Carlisle said it's turned up and and the auto archeologists guy's are doing a show on it! Maybe Dennis has found it! ;)
I thought some guy tried to pitch his as the Blue Lady a couple years ago on that show.
A few years ago I thought I had Jims car, it wasnt a pitch but just a belief that the time frame, the color, where the car had been, etc was a close second to the BLUE LADY... But alas it is just BLUE CHEER! The racers on the East coast knew the car and the name both on the streets and the track.
Quote from: TA Coupe on June 06, 2022, 06:34:54 PM
Pause for a little bit guys because I've run out of popcorn and need to make a quick run to the store for more. Got plenty of beer though. 🍺
Roy
Ha!
Hmmm, he orders a deluxe Marti Report and correct me if I am wrong but doesn't that come with a replica Shelby tag stamped with the correct numbers? How long until it surfaces with applied "Patina" and a long winded overlooked Facebook post from a dead former owner claiming he removed it and kept it in a safe deposit box and wouldn't you know, his old neighbor has they key and happens to be a fan of the show and recognized the car........
Quote from: daltondavid on June 08, 2022, 07:32:04 PM
Hmmm, he orders a deluxe Marti Report and correct me if I am wrong but doesn't that come with a replica Shelby tag stamped with the correct numbers? How long until it surfaces with applied "Patina" and a long winded overlooked Facebook post from a dead former owner claiming he removed it and kept it in a safe deposit box and wouldn't you know, his old neighbor has they key and happens to be a fan of the show and recognized the car........
Well even if he does have the rear half of the car and has the number correct, what happens if the front of the car or part of it shows up? Which is the car then? It can not be two cars with the same number.
Unfortunately in that case he has the wrong half.
Quote from: 98SVT - was 06GT on June 06, 2022, 05:26:52 PM
Quote from: rmarble57 on June 06, 2022, 05:09:05 PM
FL SAAC
Episode 200 is where the provenance is revealed. Starts around 18 minutes in.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TTeXtm9Ouos
prov·e·nance - a record of ownership of a work of art or an antique, used as a guide to authenticity or quality.
Looks like we're missing some records. Their "expert" knows paperwork not the sheetmetal. Where is their well known certified 1967 Mustang concourse judge pointing out all the differences that are on a 67 sent to SA vs ones from other assembly plants?
Can't you cut it open and count the rings? Or maybe conduct an automotive seance and reach the spirit of the Shelby.
Quote from: daltondavid on June 08, 2022, 07:32:04 PM
Hmmm, he orders a deluxe Marti Report and correct me if I am wrong but doesn't that come with a replica Shelby tag stamped with the correct numbers?
REPORT - ELITE
This report, in addition to giving you the complete factory option list and door data plate info,
includes a reproduction of your door data plate. You also get a reproduction of the window sticker and personalized production statistics that show how unique your car is. All of this is mounted behind a Ford blue matte board and installed in a 16" x 20" black frame.
Did the 67s have the door plates? They had been removed (or never installed) on the 65-6
I don't see this ever being listed in the registry. They have no ownership documents or Ford VIN on sheetmetal to show that this is the car. Even with a title the most they could hope for would be the dreaded "rebody" moniker.
This is from the Marti website:
The report is not about the authenticity of the vehicle you may own or are considering owning. It is not an evaluation about the condition of said vehicle.
Authenticity and condition are matters handled by appraisers. We are not offering an appraisal service and do not offer any opinion about the value of any particular vehicle, though we may, at times, comment about value of vehicles as a group.
Quote from: 98SVT - was 06GT on June 12, 2022, 02:04:26 PM
Quote from: daltondavid on June 08, 2022, 07:32:04 PM
Hmmm, he orders a deluxe Marti Report and correct me if I am wrong but doesn't that come with a replica Shelby tag stamped with the correct numbers?
REPORT - ELITE
This report, in addition to giving you the complete factory option list and door data plate info, includes a reproduction of your door data plate. You also get a reproduction of the window sticker and personalized production statistics that show how unique your car is. All of this is mounted behind a Ford blue matte board and installed in a 16" x 20" black frame.
Did the 67s have the door plates? They had been removed (or never installed)on the 65-6
I don't see this ever being listed in the registry. They have no ownership documents or Ford VIN on sheetmetal to show that this is the car. Even with a title the most they could hope for would be the dreaded "rebody" moniker.
This is from the Marti website:
The report is not about the authenticity of the vehicle you may own or are considering owning. It is not an evaluation about the condition of said vehicle. Authenticity and condition are matters handled by appraisers. We are not offering an appraisal service and do not offer any opinion about the value of any particular vehicle, though we may, at times, comment about value of vehicles as a group.
They were to be removed by Shelby American workers at the airport facility - most were.
Quote from: daltondavid on June 08, 2022, 07:32:04 PM
Hmmm, he orders a deluxe Marti Report and correct me if I am wrong but doesn't that come with a replica Shelby tag stamped with the correct numbers? How long until it surfaces with applied "Patina" and a long winded overlooked Facebook post from a dead former owner claiming he removed it and kept it in a safe deposit box and wouldn't you know, his old neighbor has they key and happens to be a fan of the show and recognized the car........
I truly don't think he can order a Marti report.
When we ordered ours we had to send a copy of either our cars registration or title or nothing would be sent to us
A bill of sale is not a bona fide document that proves that vehicle is what it is.
I can get my cousin Billy to give me a bill of sale to Jim Morrison's car.
Can I submit that to get a deluxe marti report with a plate ?
I have three Marti reports for three cars. I was not asked for any kind of documentation for any of them besides the money.
Quote from: shelbydoug on June 13, 2022, 08:18:46 AM
I have three Marti reports for three cars. I was not asked for any kind of documentation for any of them besides the money.
Well let me tell you when Marti purchased the invoices from Eminger they made me run through (had to find a fax machine back in the day, get my legal paper work) hoops, telling me that they would not release my information unless I could prove ownership
I guess this another case that the Benjamin's win....
Again this was my experience
I truly don't think he can order a Marti report.
When we ordered ours we had to send a copy of either our cars registration or title or nothing would be sent to us
A bill of sale is not a bona fide document that proves that vehicle is what it is.
I can get my cousin Billy to give me a bill of sale to Jim Morrison's car.
Can I submit that to get a deluxe marti report with a plate ?
I also had to send a copy of my title. :)
TOB
Quote from: FL SAAC on June 13, 2022, 07:27:31 AM
Quote from: daltondavid on June 08, 2022, 07:32:04 PM
Hmmm, he orders a deluxe Marti Report and correct me if I am wrong but doesn't that come with a replica Shelby tag stamped with the correct numbers? How long until it surfaces with applied "Patina" and a long winded overlooked Facebook post from a dead former owner claiming he removed it and kept it in a safe deposit box and wouldn't you know, his old neighbor has they key and happens to be a fan of the show and recognized the car........
I truly don't think he can order a Marti report.
When we ordered ours we had to send a copy of either our cars registration or title or nothing would be sent to us
A bill of sale is not a bona fide document that proves that vehicle is what it is.
I can get my cousin Billy to give me a bill of sale to Jim Morrison's car.
Can I submit that to get a deluxe marti report with a plate ?
Kevins own words I have heard in conversation with him:" People order Marti reports all the time for the 2 68 Bullitt Mustangs to build replicas. When an order comes through I will usually ask the purchaser why he wants it. "Imagine my surprise when the guy said he owned the car(second bullitt car found in Mexico)." Now I ordered a Marti for a 68 "Bullitt" Mustang I was buying before I bought it(390 4 speed HG GT). I did the same for my current SCJ 69 Mustang.
Quote from: FL SAAC on June 13, 2022, 08:26:23 AM
Quote from: shelbydoug on June 13, 2022, 08:18:46 AM
I have three Marti reports for three cars. I was not asked for any kind of documentation for any of them besides the money.
Well let me tell you when Marti purchased the invoices from Eminger they made me run through (had to find a fax machine back in the day, get my legal paper work) hoops, telling me that they would not release my information unless I could prove ownership
I guess this another case that the Benjamin's win....
Again this was my experience
I truly don't think he can order a Marti report.
When we ordered ours we had to send a copy of either our cars registration or title or nothing would be sent to us
A bill of sale is not a bona fide document that proves that vehicle is what it is.
I can get my cousin Billy to give me a bill of sale to Jim Morrison's car.
Can I submit that to get a deluxe marti report with a plate ?
I knew Lois. I bought numerous reports off of her starting around 1985-86. She would sell you the originals and go to kinkos to make a copy to keep in her file just in case the original got lost. You provided a copy of your title or registration I believe with Lois so she knew the current owner was getting the originals.
Now last I talked to Marti auto works I believe they said the eminger reports you would get a copy(no mention of the original if it existed or not). So I wonder if you get the original one if it exists or not. So maybe Kevin on the Eminger reports wants proof of ownership? He doesn't for Marti reports as many people order the basic ones on cars they are looking to purchase. Kevin has said he has seen forged Marti reports on Ebay auctions. He will run a "unique" car through from time to time he said to the Galaxie club here in Mi many years ago.
Quote from: TOBKOB on June 13, 2022, 08:44:48 AM
I also had to send a copy of my title. :)
TOB
for a Marti report? Or an Eminger invoice? My history on reports were no proof just a Vin.
Quote from: FL SAAC on June 13, 2022, 07:27:31 AM
Quote from: daltondavid on June 08, 2022, 07:32:04 PM
Hmmm, he orders a deluxe Marti Report and correct me if I am wrong but doesn't that come with a replica Shelby tag stamped with the correct numbers? How long until it surfaces with applied "Patina" and a long winded overlooked Facebook post from a dead former owner claiming he removed it and kept it in a safe deposit box and wouldn't you know, his old neighbor has they key and happens to be a fan of the show and recognized the car........
I truly don't think he can order a Marti report.
When we ordered ours we had to send a copy of either our cars registration or title or nothing would be sent to us
A bill of sale is not a bona fide document that proves that vehicle is what it is.
I can get my cousin Billy to give me a bill of sale to Jim Morrison's car.
Can I submit that to get a deluxe marti report with a plate ?
I have gotten several Marti reports on cars I did not own with no paperwork required........especially if you are looking to buy a car to verify options on it etc....
this is in last couple years
It depends on the year and model. Most years no issues. 1967 Shelbys require both the Ford and Shelby VIN. There a lot of things getting mixed in here that not relevant.
Lois would also ask for a Vin rubbing as proof of ownership, I think I provided that along with a copy of bill of sale and title once.
Quote from: rcgt350 on June 13, 2022, 11:46:09 AM
Lois would also ask for a Vin rubbing as proof of ownership, I think I provided that along with a copy of bill of sale and title once.
thanks. I don't recall exactly what she wanted but have all of her sales literature so I can look at that. It took her months to find the one for my Shelby just before she sold them all to Marti in early 2000s. It took me a while to get smart and order them. I figured I had enough documentation. You never have enough documentation.
Quotefor a Marti report? Or an Eminger invoice? My history on reports were no proof just a Vin.
Lois Eminger asked for a copy of title probably in the 80's. This was for my '69 so maybe apples and oranges... :)
TOB
Guys big difference in getting original invoices aka Emminger ( you have to prove ownership)
Vs getting a regular Marti report ( not Elite) report showing way car was built ( no proof of ownership required )
Quote from: SCJSTU on June 13, 2022, 10:50:18 PM
Guys big difference in getting original invoices aka Emminger ( you have to prove ownership)
Vs getting a regular Marti report ( not Elite) report showing way car was built ( no proof of ownership required )
But since the Shelby Marti reports include both Shelby and Ford VINs he typically takes extra precautions/requirements so that not just anyone can pay and get that information. Maybe in this case someone had a connection or called in a favor. DO NOT know for certain
That is a detail that Lois ever needed to deal with since she only had limited years and only one plant
Quote from: J_Speegle on June 13, 2022, 11:20:44 PM
Quote from: SCJSTU on June 13, 2022, 10:50:18 PM
Guys big difference in getting original invoices aka Emminger ( you have to prove ownership)
Vs getting a regular Marti report ( not Elite) report showing way car was built ( no proof of ownership required )
But since the Shelby Marti reports include both Shelby and Ford VINs he typically takes extra precautions/requirements so that not just anyone can pay and get that information. Maybe in this case someone had a connection or called in a favor. DO NOT know for certain
That is a detail that Lois ever needed to deal with since she only had limited years and only one plant
She had multiple plants depending on year and car line. I.E. 1970 she had both Metuchin and Dearborn for Mustangs.
So say there is a 67 Shelby on BaT and there are both vins available I'm sure I can get a Marti report. I got both vins on some 1967 Shelbys via auctions. So if Collins calls up Marti auto works with both the Ford Vin off the trans and gets a "hit" on the Shelby number do you think Marti auto works sends a Marti report to him? I'd say so. I guess 1967 Shelby owners can settle this one as what did they have to provide to get a report? Just both vins off of their car that match the data base or other info? Seems weird I can get a report for a 68 or 69 Shelby without proof of ownership but not a 67 when providing the pertinent info?
On the '67 GT350 I had, I supplied the both the Ford and Shelby VIN's, which I had already supplied and had verified - known numbers - by the SAAC Registrar (THANKS DAVE!) via phone to Marti Autoworks and they sent me the report. I did not get the framed version that provides a recreated VIN Door plate.
Edit: Never got one, and didn't realize it's the door tag - Thanks.
Quote from: JD on June 14, 2022, 06:28:44 AM
I did not get the framed version that provides a recreated VIN plate.
It is
NOT a VIN plate. It is the door tag. They were attached to a removable part of the car and not to be used for registration. They had information that was useful for the service department such as trans, rear end info and date built for any running changes to parts.
You can get an "officially licensed" one with the rivets for $30 on ebay - https://www.ebay.com/itm/121814389580?chn=ps&_trkparms=ispr%3D1&amdata=enc%3A1GGObBLwWQv6GQs_uCod-kA91&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-117182-37290-0&mkcid=2&itemid=121814389580&targetid=1644837434763&device=c&mktype=&googleloc=9031216&poi=&campaignid=16743749222&mkgroupid=138744546207&rlsatarget=pla-1644837434763&abcId=9300842&merchantid=101723242&gclid=CjwKCAjw46CVBhB1EiwAgy6M4jsqM54Jh07HboLbOGZmBYawkncW1onlE3E_rkmWlgL7QaqOO8NWCBoC49sQAvD_BwE
Quote from: 427hunter on May 27, 2022, 06:12:40 PM
Dennis Collins now claims his 67 mustang is 1477 - Dave ?
Door tags, door tags, door tags, Gentlemen please !
We have completely derailed this topic "67 mustang is 1477 ? "
Quote from: FL SAAC on June 14, 2022, 12:27:53 PM
Quote from: 427hunter on May 27, 2022, 06:12:40 PM
Dennis Collins now claims his 67 mustang is 1477 - Dave ?
Door tags, door tags, door tags, Gentlemen please !
We have completely derailed this topic "67 mustang is 1477 ? "
now Dennis knows where to get a door tag for his 67. ;D ;D ;D
So what is the most valuable car in Dennis's collection, the Vietnam Car?....the half a Shelby?...or the next big find...aka "HOLY GRAIL CAR" ? ....Wait... ::) ....all his cars are ...HOLY GRAIL CARS!... :o
UHHH - OHHH The FULL PINNOCHIO!!!!! :-[
kool