John sent me a smaller photo of the 3/4 view photo asking for any info such as the car, date, location, and driver.
My notes have this listed as csx2009 in September 1963 at Waterford Hills, MI and driven by Tom Payne. Not sure if it was taken in 9/1 or 9/28-9/29
John adds the fellow checking the gas cap is Ben Harris.
Anyone have any other info to share about these two photos?
I suspect "Kranky" might know a bit more...
All my paperwork is up north in the autodrome, but caption on my copy says head on shot is Sept 1 other is Sept 29. Here's another Al Bizer shot from June 1963.
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/187-200818153802.jpeg)
Air jacks on CSX2009??
Quote from: jguyer on August 20, 2018, 03:40:47 PM
All my paperwork is up north in the autodrome, but caption on my copy says head on shot is Sept 1 other is Sept 29. Here's another Al Bizer shot from June 1963.
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/187-200818153802.jpeg)
John, thanks for noting those dates and the added pic from June '63!
Rich,
No thanks needed.
This all helps me document Ben's infant building in the SCCA, 1950-1960.
He held many titles with the SCCA over the years.
Chairman of the Chicago SCCA region for years also.
Part owner of Road America also, just cool stuff that will be introduced in the future.
So >> Tom Payne, sept 1963, Michigan raceway, correct?
Waterford Hills Road Course. Waterford, MI. I think mailing address is Clarkston, MI.
jguyer is most likely correct on identifying the Tom Payne photos (Harris Speedster/Richstang posting). Tom ran the Cobra under #113 for both events 9/1/63 and 9/28/63....but there are a few minor differences in the two events if you look at the photos closely. In the top photo, most of the people are in short sleeves (rolled up, etc.), most likely temps in the 60-70's finishing in the later afternoon hours (lack of shadows most likely an overcast day)? While in the second photo, most of the fans in the back ground and around the Cobra are wearing jackets. Without looking in to old weather archives, I would have to assume that both photos were different events.
To Jim....I think the port that you are seeing on the passenger side of the Cobra is for charging the battery externally (it wasn't there when we purchased the Cobra, the fenders were all ready modified (custom) to the later model side vents). The first time I remember seeing any sort of air jacking system was on the Chevrolet Grand Sport Corvettes.
Kranky
Quote from: kranky on August 20, 2018, 11:47:58 PM
jguyer is most likely correct on identifying the Tom Payne photos (Harris Speedster/Richstang posting). Tom ran the Cobra under #113 for both events 9/1/63 and 9/28/63....but there are a few minor differences in the two events if you look at the photos closely. In the top photo, most of the people are in short sleeves (rolled up, etc.), most likely temps in the 60-70's finishing in the later afternoon hours (lack of shadows most likely an overcast day)? While in the second photo, most of the fans in the back ground and around the Cobra are wearing jackets. Without looking in to old weather archives, I would have to assume that both photos were different events.
To Jim....I think the port that you are seeing on the passenger side of the Cobra is for charging the battery externally (it wasn't there when we purchased the Cobra, the fenders were all ready modified (custom) to the later model side vents). The first time I remember seeing any sort of air jacking system was on the Chevrolet Grand Sport Corvettes.
Kranky
Fantastic observations Kranky!
Great eye kranky !!!!!
One must look at pictures with real intent if they are documenting>> anything actually.
So;
Waterford Hills Michigan, sept 28th-29th, Tom Payne
Quote from: Richstang on August 20, 2018, 02:12:02 PM
John sent me a smaller photo of the 3/4 view photo asking for any info such as the car, date, location, and driver.
My notes have this listed as csx2009 in September 1963 at Waterford Hills, MI and driven by Tom Payne. Not sure if it was taken in 9/1 or 9/28-9/29
John adds the fellow checking the gas cap is Ben Harris.
Anyone have any other info to share about these two photos?
I suspect "Kranky" might know a bit more...
In the bottom Photo, that looks like Jackie Gleeson in the White Coat.............
John asked that I post this photo of Ben to help avoid any further confusion.
Quote from: jguyer on August 20, 2018, 09:51:37 PM
Waterford Hills Road Course. Waterford, MI. I think mailing address is Clarkston, MI.
+1
jim p
Quote from: jguyer on August 20, 2018, 03:40:47 PM
All my paperwork is up north in the autodrome, but caption on my copy says head on shot is Sept 1 other is Sept 29. Here's another Al Bizer shot from June 1963.
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/187-200818153802.jpeg)
Is the windshield a 1-off? doesn't look like a SAI competition parts seen on other comp cars ??
just trying to learn !!
jim p
I would also say that the photos were from two different days, the fonts for the numbers are different and there is deffinetly differences in the body area where the auxiliary lighting tabs were coming through. One photo clearly shows the auxiliary lighting mounting tabs and the other photo the same area looks to just have holes. Also interesting to note is the hood handles are installed backwards.
Really like the vintage photos!
Ok;
Tom Payne
Waterford Hills Road Course
Clarkston Michigan
September 29th, 1963
Trying to document Ben from Golden gate, to Cuba, to Sebring, the Glen, Bridgehampton , Road America plus another dozen or more tracks.
I do my best to keep facts as correct as possible.
BTW, this may be the last picture of Ben in SCCA official status, cool that it was by a race winning AC Cobra.
Thanks guys,
John
In regards to the cut down windshield (plexi and aluminum strip base)....2002, 2011, 2017 and 2196 are the only ones that I can think of at the moment besides 2009. I'm sure there were other Cobras with a similar style of windshield.
Quote from: kranky on August 22, 2018, 11:43:38 AM
In regards to the cut down windshield (plexi and aluminum strip base)....2002, 2011, 2017 and 2196 are the only ones that I can think of at the moment besides 2009. I'm sure there were other Cobras with a similar style of windshield.
Didn't Gerber have CSX2027 with a cut down windshield at one time? Maybe the Badger 200?
To Jim:
If you are referring to the Scott Sperka photo on the RSC website, that photo is miss-identified as 2027, but it is 2009....one of the first Cobras out there with a full roll cage.
Quote from: kranky on August 22, 2018, 03:19:02 PM
To Jim:
If you are referring to the Scott Sperka photo on the RSC website, that photo is miss-identified as 2027, but it is 2009....one of the first Cobras out there with a full roll cage.
Yep, that's the one. Thanks for the clarification ;)
Is this CSX2009 at a winter race ? pretty wild wing on it :o
Kranky ?
Mike
Definitely not....looks like an extended and modified fiberglass Cobra body with some unique mods. 009's last official race was at Watkins Glen in August of 1971.
Thanks kranky, for some reason I had that photo i.d'd as 2009, should have known better, looks like a dachshund ::)
Mike