Hi guys,
Anyone know much about this 65 on Ebay? I wonder what reserve is
https://m.ebay.com/itm/1965-Ford-Mustang-Shelby-GT350/123354235383?hash=item1cb87c41f7:g:0MEAAOSwaGBbkBKE
Cheers
Geez. They even posted a shot of the full Ford VIN on the block. :o
Not a car we see on EBay too often anymore.
Copying in the text for when the ad expires:
Item specifics
Condition:
Used
Seller Notes:
"This Shelby GT350 was rotisserie restored in 1986. The restoration has aged well. The interior has little wear."
Year: 1965 VIN (Vehicle Identification Number): SFM5S296
Mileage: 39,957 Interior Color: Black
Make: Ford Number of Cylinders: 8
Model:
Mustang
Transmission: Manual
Trim: Shelby GT350 Body Type: Coupe
Engine: 289 K Code Warranty: Vehicle does NOT have an existing warranty
Drive Type: RWD Vehicle Title: Clear
For Sale By: Private Seller Exterior Color: White
1965 Mustang Shelby GT350: Well documented ownership history in the SAAC Shelby Registry . A rotisserie restoration completed in 1985 by the second owner. Currently in excellent running and driving condition.
Body: The original owner cut the fender wells when the car was new to utilize larger wheels for racing. At the same time a R series front apron was also installed. The car looked similar to the picture in the gallery, and could be this car. No racing history is currently available. The 2nd owner sourced 4 factory Ford fenders and installed them prior to the restoration. The paint used at the time was "performance pack" which was a combination of enamel and urethane which has aged properly. This car is a early GT350 which has the proper rear battery installation.
Engine: According to the 2nd owner as well as the numbers stamped on the block the engine is original to the car. Rebuilt in 1985 with heads done by Crane. Runs excellent., Very powerful with a throaty exhaust installed by the second owner during the restoration. According to the 2nd owner the transmission that was installed when he received it was a Top Loader which he replaced with the correct aluminum T10M which it still has today. Transmission shift perfectly with proper clutch feel.
Interior: The interior includes reproduction seats installed during the restoration as well as what appears to be a reproduction steering wheel which could be explained by the below documents from the registry. The other elements appear original or new old stock.
Chassis: Restored condition. Correct date stamped steel wheels. Koni Shocks, side exit exhaust completed during the restoration.
History Synopsis: I have reached out the the owners listed in the SCCA Shelby Registry.
Below I will quote the Shelby registry which may have some inaccuracies. I have read that every person involved with the car would normally show, but some are dealers. The dealer that brokered the car from owner 1 to owner 2 was a huge help in piecing together the cars life. Along with him the 2nd owner generously supplied me with a great deal of details on the car. I thank both of them very much. I have edited the names out out of the ownership history.
The below quoted from the 4th edition 2011 of the SAAC Shelby Registry 1965-1966-1967
"5S296 Date received at Shelby America 5/17/65; date work started 5/19/65; date work finished 5/25/65; date ordered 7/23/65. Shipped to Bowditch Ford (Newport News, VA) 8/4/65; they were invoiced $3,547 plus $214 for Crager Wheels plus $90.25 freight for a total of $3,851.25. 9/29/65 Bowditch replaced the damaged steering wheel."
History I have derived:
Purchased by (owner 1) (West Cornwall, CT) There is a discrepancy here -owner 2 was a broker/dealer whom I spoke too (sold in 1985 with 36,000 miles. He sold it to who really is owner 2. Owner 2 (Phoenix, MD.) sold to owner 3 (unknown name, but the current owner told me it sat in a collection for 25 years with out being driven or altered. Owner 4 purchased the car in 2015, and has put very few miles on it. It now shows what I believe to be original miles of 39957.
"Correct date stamped steel wheels."
oh boy
I saw that too.
Quote from: Bigfoot on September 07, 2018, 09:09:57 AM
Not a car we see on EBay too often anymore.
Agree, not too many 65s
Price moving up...150k now
Quote from: Shelby_0022 on September 07, 2018, 08:11:42 AM
Geez. They even posted a shot of the full Ford VIN on the block. :o
What's wrong with that? If I were going to buy a 65 for a lot of dough, I'd want to know the Ford VIN ???
I asked the same question a few months back and got a concise reply from Mr. Gaines:
Quote from: Bob Gaines on February 12, 2018, 01:52:42 AM
Quote from: Jim Herrud on February 12, 2018, 01:34:44 AM
Not to hijack the thread, but I have a newbie question. This is the second time I've seen a forum reference to accidentally showing a Ford VIN number. Can someone explain what the faux pas is here? Is this a legal issue, or simply one of etiquette or something else? Just curious. Thx!
In the past unscrupulous people have made up a car using vin numbers from another . In the case of 65,66 and 67 Shelby the Ford VIN is hidden under the Shelby vin plate . The Shelby VIN is different then the Ford VIN number. The SACC registry knows which Ford VIN number goes with what Shelby VIN number. If someone attempts to fake a car and the hidden Ford number doesn't match what is on the books it is exposed as a fake. Since the number is hidden on the 65,66,67 year cars it is harder to fake those. If both numbers are known it is easier to fake one. The hidden number sometimes gets exposed by accident which is like the reference you have seen. I hope this helps.
Quote from: Jim Herrud on September 07, 2018, 10:49:24 PM
I asked the same question a few months back and got a concise reply from Mr. Gaines:
Quote from: Bob Gaines on February 12, 2018, 01:52:42 AM
Quote from: Jim Herrud on February 12, 2018, 01:34:44 AM
Not to hijack the thread, but I have a newbie question. This is the second time I've seen a forum reference to accidentally showing a Ford VIN number. Can someone explain what the faux pas is here? Is this a legal issue, or simply one of etiquette or something else? Just curious. Thx!
In the past unscrupulous people have made up a car using vin numbers from another . In the case of 65,66 and 67 Shelby the Ford VIN is hidden under the Shelby vin plate . The Shelby VIN is different then the Ford VIN number. The SACC registry knows which Ford VIN number goes with what Shelby VIN number. If someone attempts to fake a car and the hidden Ford number doesn't match what is on the books it is exposed as a fake. Since the number is hidden on the 65,66,67 year cars it is harder to fake those. If both numbers are known it is easier to fake one. The hidden number sometimes gets exposed by accident which is like the reference you have seen. I hope this helps.
Bingo! Again, I wouldn't buy a car that hadn't been verified by SAAC, and there are ways to do this as a buyer / seller without divulging the Ford VIN. So, the point is well taken both ways. :)
Quote from: 69mach351w on September 07, 2018, 10:01:12 PM
Quote from: Shelby_0022 on September 07, 2018, 08:11:42 AM
Geez. They even posted a shot of the full Ford VIN on the block. :o
What's wrong with that? If I were going to buy a 65 for a lot of dough, I'd want to know the Ford VIN ???
But you don't need the world to see it.
Unless you were joking...
What number did they stop putting the battery in the trunk?
Quote from: Shelby_0022 on September 08, 2018, 09:19:07 AM
Quote from: Jim Herrud on September 07, 2018, 10:49:24 PM
I asked the same question a few months back and got a concise reply from Mr. Gaines:
Quote from: Bob Gaines on February 12, 2018, 01:52:42 AM
Quote from: Jim Herrud on February 12, 2018, 01:34:44 AM
Not to hijack the thread, but I have a newbie question. This is the second time I've seen a forum reference to accidentally showing a Ford VIN number. Can someone explain what the faux pas is here? Is this a legal issue, or simply one of etiquette or something else? Just curious. Thx!
In the past unscrupulous people have made up a car using vin numbers from another . In the case of 65,66 and 67 Shelby the Ford VIN is hidden under the Shelby vin plate . The Shelby VIN is different then the Ford VIN number. The SACC registry knows which Ford VIN number goes with what Shelby VIN number. If someone attempts to fake a car and the hidden Ford number doesn't match what is on the books it is exposed as a fake. Since the number is hidden on the 65,66,67 year cars it is harder to fake those. If both numbers are known it is easier to fake one. The hidden number sometimes gets exposed by accident which is like the reference you have seen. I hope this helps.
Bingo! Again, I wouldn't buy a car that hadn't been verified by SAAC, and there are ways to do this as a buyer / seller without divulging the Ford VIN. So, the point is well taken both ways. :)
Agree, get an expert and get Howard involved in the process. Approachable helpful guy; he might even tell you a story or 2 about his R!
T Bird wheels
Agree, get an expert and get Howard involved in the process. Approachable helpful guy; he might even tell you a story or 2 about his R!
[/quote]
++1, Howard is a great, helpful person and will be a great help to whoever is serious about this machine!
Quote from: Shelby_0022 on September 07, 2018, 08:11:42 AM
Geez. They even posted a shot of the full Ford VIN on the block. :o
I don't understand. I thought Ford didn't start stamping VIN's into blocks until 1968. How does a 65 have a VIN stamped block if this didn't become a manufacturing norm until three years later?
QSS
Quote from: QuickSilverShelby on September 08, 2018, 10:42:16 PM
Quote from: Shelby_0022 on September 07, 2018, 08:11:42 AM
Geez. They even posted a shot of the full Ford VIN on the block. :o
I don't understand. I thought Ford didn't start stamping VIN's into blocks until 1968. How does a 65 have a VIN stamped block if this didn't become a manufacturing norm until three years later?
QSS
The Hipo blocks were VIN stamped in 65, 66 and 67 due to the shorter warranty Ford provided for the K-codes.
Quote from: QuickSilverShelby on September 08, 2018, 10:42:16 PM
Quote from: Shelby_0022 on September 07, 2018, 08:11:42 AM
Geez. They even posted a shot of the full Ford VIN on the block. :o
I don't understand. I thought Ford didn't start stamping VIN's into blocks until 1968. How does a 65 have a VIN stamped block if this didn't become a manufacturing norm until three years later?
QSS
All early Shelby's should have the VIN stamping . Those that don't generally have some "story" as to how theirs is the exception, blah blah blah......
FWIW, a VIN Stamped engine block is only an indication of originality, NOT proof f anything. Many people think nothing about having replacement blocks stamped during an overhaul or restoration. Done by an experienced person, a subsequent block stamping cannot be told from an original one.
So buyer beware, don't pay extra for a meaningless stamp, without other substantiating evidence that the block / engine is original.
Z
^^
This
Thanks for the education.
QSS
Quote from: zray on September 09, 2018, 10:48:22 AM
All early Shelby's should have the VIN stamping . Those that don't generally have some "story" as to how theirs is the exception, blah blah blah......
FWIW, a VIN Stamped engine block is only an indication of originality, NOT proof f anything. Many people think nothing about having replacement blocks stamped during an overhaul or restoration. Done by an experienced person, a subsequent block stamping cannot be told from an original one.
So buyer beware, don't pay extra for a meaningless stamp, without other substantiating evidence that the block / engine is original.
Z
I am reminded of this article from Hemming;
https://www.hemmings.com/magazine/mus/2008/08/Just-a-Second---1968-Chevrolet-Camaro-Z-28/1676538.html
I am amazed just how many performance cars from the 60's are now all numbers matching with all original parts and just one repaint. ::)
Quote from: QuickSilverShelby on September 08, 2018, 10:42:16 PM
Quote from: Shelby_0022 on September 07, 2018, 08:11:42 AM
Geez. They even posted a shot of the full Ford VIN on the block. :o
I don't understand. I thought Ford didn't start stamping VIN's into blocks until 1968. How does a 65 have a VIN stamped block if this didn't become a manufacturing norm until three years later?
QSS
68 was when engine VIN stamping was federally mandated. Prior to 68 it was common for Ford to stamp some part of a 65-67 high performance engine drive train (block and or trans) for law enforcement identification purposes because those vehicles were thought to be more prone to be stolen and or parted out .
Quote from: 2112 on September 09, 2018, 12:10:18 PM
Quote from: zray on September 09, 2018, 10:48:22 AM
All early Shelby's should have the VIN stamping . Those that don't generally have some "story" as to how theirs is the exception, blah blah blah......
FWIW, a VIN Stamped engine block is only an indication of originality, NOT proof f anything. Many people think nothing about having replacement blocks stamped during an overhaul or restoration. Done by an experienced person, a subsequent block stamping cannot be told from an original one.
So buyer beware, don't pay extra for a meaningless stamp, without other substantiating evidence that the block / engine is original.
Z
I am reminded of this article from Hemming;
https://www.hemmings.com/magazine/mus/2008/08/Just-a-Second---1968-Chevrolet-Camaro-Z-28/1676538.html
I am amazed just how many performance cars from the 60's are now all numbers matching with all original parts and just one repaint. ::)
Disturbing of the lengths people will go to rip others off. Whenever there are lots of cash involved, people do whatever they can to take your money.
Including fake bids in an attempt raise prices! Private auctions are nothing but.
Quote from: Bob Gaines on September 09, 2018, 12:24:50 PM
Quote from: QuickSilverShelby on September 08, 2018, 10:42:16 PM
Quote from: Shelby_0022 on September 07, 2018, 08:11:42 AM
Geez. They even posted a shot of the full Ford VIN on the block. :o
I don't understand. I thought Ford didn't start stamping VIN's into blocks until 1968. How does a 65 have a VIN stamped block if this didn't become a manufacturing norm until three years later?
QSS
68 was when engine VIN stamping was federally mandated. Prior to 68 it was common for Ford to stamp some part of a 65-67 high performance engine drive train (block and or trans) for law enforcement identification purposes because those vehicles were thought to be more prone to be stolen and or parted out .
Thanks Bob.
QSS
Quote from: Hockeylife on September 09, 2018, 02:22:37 PM
Including fake bids in an attempt raise prices! Private auctions are nothing but.
Ebay is full of shill bidding too.
Z
Forgot to Re-Register on this site after the crash-
It's cool to see this car surfaced after many years in hibernation. My dad was the (2nd owner) of it and ended up selling it to a guy in California. Less that Steering wheel my dad said it appears to be the same way he sold it back in the 80's..