The original thread on the old forum was started by JD way back in October 2010.
I'm going to attempt to rebuild many of its components starting with the original post and the text JD wrote. I'll follow with an updated list.
Please be patient with me while I put this together. (Perhaps holding back comments until I can gather / post some of the informational posts and photos.)
Here's a link to the archived thread in the meanwhile.
http://web.archive.org/web/20101220133733/http://saacforum.com/index.php?topic=10461.0
JD's Original 2010 forum text
Like them or loathe them a number of 1967 Shelby Mustangs got lights at the rear of the upper scoops on the sail panels. This is an attempt to compile a list of cars up to or about the first 200 believed to be the cut-off point of these having been installed by Shelby American employees at the Los Angeles airport facility. This is a work in progress and like many of the running changes on the '67's it is difficult at times to determine what was on these cars when they where completed and is to start a discussion to better understand this running change. I'm sure others know more on this than I do and will have input on this.
Some early sales literature for the '67's show Lowell Otter's '67 Red GT500 Prototype with a chrome ring, similar to or the same as the tail lights on some Daytona Coupes. The ones used on most(?) of the production cars were without the chrome ring. (These were also used as clearance lights on the trailers of semi's of the day.)
While referencing the '97 Registry and compiling a list of cars from #143 and up (it seems as though most of the cars prior to this did get them (car #22 did not) - if you have or know of a car below #143 that does not have them please post it) it was interesting to note that car #145 (GT350) does have them and was completed 1-6-67. Cars completed on 1-6-67 range from #145 to #328 which begs the question are there cars up into the 300's that have these lights?
Also interesting that the first week of January 1967, Tuesday the 3rd through Friday the 6th, 81 cars were completed! Fred Goodell was working at Shelby in December of 1966 and he is the one that implemented many procedures to complete cars faster and discovered that these light were not legal in many states prompting their being discontinued.
JD's original list with updates. Newest updates are in red.
Car # Model Lights Completed by Shelby American
142 350 Yes 12-16-66
143 350 Yes 12-19-66
144 350 Yes 12-16-66
145 350 Yes 1-6-67
146 350 ? 12-14-66
147 350 Yes 12-14-66 Updated 12/31/2020
148 350 ? 12-16-66
149 350 Yes 12-29-66
150 350 Yes 12-14-66
151 350 Yes 12-19-66
152 350 ? 12-14-66
153 350 No 12-14-66
154 350 ? 12-14-66
155 350 Yes 1-10-67
156 350 Yes 12-14-66
157 350 Yes 12-14-66
158 350 Yes 12-16-66
159 350 No 12-21-66
160 350 No 12-16-66
161 350 ? 12-14-66
162 350 ? 1-5-67
163 350 ? 12-22-66
164 500 ? 12-22-66
165 350 No 1-3-67
166 350 No 12-21-66
167 500 No* 1-4-67
168 350 No 1-6-66 (corrected SAI completion date]
169 350 No 12-21-66
170 350 ? 1-3-67
171 500 No 1-19-67
172 350 ? 12-28-66
173 500 No 12-12-66
174 350 ? 12-21-66
175 350 ? 1-20-67
176 Eng Yes^ 9-?-66 Lime Gold Prototype?
177 500 ? 12-28-66
178 500 ? 12-28-66
179 500 ? 12-28-66
180 500 ? 1-4-67
181 350 No 12-30-66
182 500 ? 1-4-67
183 500 ? 1-4-67
184 350 ? 12-21-66
185 500 No 1-4-67
186 500 ? 12-22-66
187 500 No* 12-22-66
188 500 ? 1-3-67
189 500 No 1-4-67
190 500 No* 1-4-67
191 500 ? 12-30-66
192 500 ? 1-5-67
193 500 ? 1-3-67
194 500 No* 1-5-67
195 500 No 1-4-67
196 500 ? 1-12-67
197 500 ? 12-22-66
198 500 ? 1-4-67
199 500 ? 1-5-67
200 500 No 1-6-67 Reported as wired, no lights 11/26/2018
201 500 ? 1-4-67
202 500 No 1-4-67
203 500 No 12-30-66
204 350 ? 1-6-67
205 500 ? 1-3-67
206 500 ? 1-4-67
207 500 ? 1-4-67
208 500 No 1-4-67
209 500 ? 1-3-67
210 500 No 1-4-67
211 500 No 1-4-67
212 500 No 1-3-67
213 500 No 1-4-67
* Lights have been added by a previous or current owner
^ Lights have outer chrome ring
Here are some of the replies specific to the actual scoops and lights (in blue text) with great information noted in the original post....(photos added are not necessarily the originals posted as some were lost)
Bob Gaines
I believe there was not a different light receptacle with a chrome ring it was just how the light fixture was prepared in paint. The entire socket assembly is plated and if all but the surrounding ring is painted the ring shows up very bright. It is reasonable to believe this distracted from the look and instructions must have been given to paint the entire outside of the socket body color so only the red lens was visible. Just my thoughts on the subject.
The receptacle is bonded and recessed into the fiberglass . Some more so then others.
Lowell (67st102)
If you study the scoop lights on the two 1967 Shelby brochure vehicles, the lime green prototype GT350 and the red prototype GT500 (V7382), you will notice a rubber gasket base with chrome ring around the light. As JD points out, this light is the same, or very similar, to the round tail lights that appear on the Daytona coupes. My assumption is that since the lights were in the shop for the Daytona coupes, they were available for prototype trial on the two brochure Shelby's. My second assumption then is that once production started a less expensive light assembly was utilized.
I am attaching photos of both the lime green GT350 and the red GT500 scoop lights for reference. Also attached for comparison and reference is a rear photo of a Daytona coupe. Finally, I am attaching a couple of photos of the "rubber base, chrome ring" light assembly. This is obviously different from the typical truck marker light that was installed on the early 1967 Shelby's. Just my thoughts regarding the scoop lights used on the two prototype 1967 brochure vehicles vs. the regular production early scoop light cars.
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/204-010218145332.jpeg)
Besides the taillights, notice there is a side mounted light on the quarter panel of the Daytona behind the door glass area in the same style.
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/204-010218151849.jpeg)
Bob Gaines
Lowell, you have convinced me that the lights in the picture are the same as the un installed light assembly pictures or darn close. It is comparable to the Daytona Coupe but the coupe lights looks to be a larger version of the same light to me. It is very logical and reasonable to believe that the Daytona light, based on your comparison was the inspiration for the use as it looks identical with the exception of size to me. I don't believe however that the particular light you show was ever used in regular production. The production receptacle is different and the lens is decidedly more cone shaped.
Bob B. (19-GT350-67)
Took this photo on Saturday at the Simone Musemum, south Philly, PA.
It's Daytona Coupe CSX2287. Tail lights are glass units manufactured by Lucas in England. I agree that this earlier design on the Coupe may have been the design inspiration for the early '67 lights in the air extractor concept.
What a great design feature IMHO! It's usually the first question asked at any car show for car #63.
tommyd
Regarding the depression area on the upper scoops; some of those may not be where an opening originally was, but instead the "head" end of the threaded stud that attaches the scoop. It is embedded in the fiberglass. I had seen similar depressions and assumed it was the light issue, but in reassembling my car after paint job, I over tightened that stud and it created the mysterious depression. I guess to make sure, measurements would tell the story. The red light is located pretty close to the rear opening of the scoop.
JD
Here is a photo of the back of a scoop with the light and the stud, may help illustrate Tommy's post.
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/204-010218214428.jpeg)
jimbob
Does anyone know if there is part number or manufacturer stamp on either the base or the lense?
Any identifying markings like "Guide" on the lense or base?
Bob Gaines
The trademark is DZ and the name of the company is Dietz.
Here's some replies (in blue text) specific to the time when they were installed as well as some very early cars that didn't get them.
Dave (GT350DAVE)
Looking at the database, it appears that most of the cars were done by date and most before car #168, but not all because there are a dozen cars after that which have them and there are many with lower Vins that did not receive them regardless of the early date. An example of this is a very early car that I am familiar with that has a very low Vin and was completed 11/11/66 that never received them.
There were 12 GT 500's that were reported by owners that have them, most in the #160's to 200 but a few in the #300-400 range.
To add to the confusion there are also some late cars reported that I suspect had them added by a previous owner.
Road Reptile
Hi to all. The post by Dave pertaining to cars done by date is the only theory that I have ever been able to make sense out of, and it also dovetails another that I have yet to prove about color batches...this would explain the few exceptions that we see on car numbers that appear out of normal sequence. They were possibly done and installed as needed by color, not car number. It also supports the less than 200--looks more like about 150-160 max.
It has been questioned also if the lime gold car with the chrome base lights could be the missing numbered G.T.350 as many people that have a Marti report are quick to notice the production number is quoted as 1174 and this may be the small block mule car--not assigned a Shelby vin. Maybe this will keep us all guessing till the registry is out??
Regards from R.R.
(early67350)
I've got car #22 that I've owned since 1973. It did not have any protruding light/holder on the outside but when I pulled the scoops off before putting it back on the road in '75, it had wiring attached to the inside of the scoop. It was right where the light should have been. The other end of the wiring was not attached to the wiring harness or anything. In chalk on the fiberglass it said #0022.
Reserved for original forum posts...
Max (Alan)
#0029 does not have an outer ring painted or otherwise. The red lens takes approx a 1/8 " cw turn into the scoop's rear.
roddster
#0036 with them, painted, not chrome base. I have seen one or two with the chrome base.
Henry (67GT350-0078)
0078 has them but then again it is one of those completed the end of October that seem to have their own very interesting features including hand-lettered VIN tag....
Mark (1967gt350)
Hi, just want to add that YES car #0157 has the scoop lights. Thanks
Bill Collins
Here is a photo of '67 350 #168 when it was at Cobra Automotive a couple of years ago. I recall that '67 Registrar Dave Mathews had it for sale at the time. No scoop lights.
cobreen
Car #187 have them, but not the correct ones. Built 12.09.66 at San Jose
Chris (cbrown)
Car #210 does not have them.
stephen_becker
Car #213 does not have them
Rich (67 GT500-00314)
I am the 4th owner of #314, built San Jose 12/21/66,
completed at Shelby American 1/12/67. It has the scoop
lights. I have not been able to speak with any of the previous
owners to determine if they are original or were added.
Ford VIN is in the 7R02Q154XXX range.
JD
Rich, maybe if you posted a couple photos of a light with and without the lens the judges could give a comment.
Rich (67 GT500-00314)
My lights do have the Dietz lens. I will take a picture of the light with the
lens removed when I get a chance. Dave Mathews mentioned to me that
my build date is late to have the lights. My lights are only running lights,
not brake and directional. I'm hoping they are original to the car but if they
are not I will leave them as I think they are a cool feature.
Rich,
If no. 22 has a Shelby American completion date of 11/5/66, then why didn't it come with upper red scoop lights?
Are there any GT500's that are definitely known to have been delivered with upper red scoop lights, besides car no. 100 (Engineering car, 1st GT500) and V7382 (Shelby Prototype)?
Quote from: BGlover67 on February 01, 2018, 07:21:58 PM
Rich,
If no. 22 has a Shelby American completion date of 11/5/66, then why didn't it come with upper red scoop lights?
Are there any GT500's that are definitely known to have been delivered with upper red scoop lights, besides car no. 100 (Engineering car, 1st GT500) and V7382 (Shelby Prototype)?
Both of these are tough questions Brian. There are only a handful of known cars in the double digits that don't have the upper scoop lights,
but #0022 is the only one I'm aware of with a 1966 SA completion date. The other few were completed in January 1967 or later and are more understandable.
In my opinion (for what it's worth), other than #0100 there are no definite GT500's that left the factory with the upper scoop lists. The next GT500 with them is in the #0160's. When you get up that high up the build dates become questionable if they had them or if they were added. With Fred Goodell arriving in December anything built in December / January has to be looked at very closely. There could be a couple of cars that were wired (perhaps even disconnected) that never received the scoop lights because the mandate to stop adding them was given. Lots to consider...
Well, I'm happy to state that 0022 (my car) DID come with red lights. The previous owner confirmed previously that the car had been repainted prior to when he received the car in 1973, and that he noticed the wiring to the scoop lights was in place when 0022 went though it's first restoration in the mid to late 80s. One of the previous owners had removed the lights for some reason.
"She's a beaut, Clark!" ;D
It helps if I read the thread before answering.
Jim Clark (the previous owner of 43 years) mentions the same - the wiring was there for rhe scoop lights. It seems it wasn't attached to the main harness; which would have followed suit with the previous owner having removed and disconnected the lights.
Sorry for the redundancy!
#45 has them, no chrome on base, wiring there
Don't know if this will help.
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/107-020218120604.jpeg)
Quote from: Vcode on February 02, 2018, 12:08:41 PM
Don't know if this will help.
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/107-020218120604.jpeg)
Vcode, that is a comparison I did to show the difference in the lights on the "missing" car used in the promotional pieces with the Lucas Daytona coupe style lights with the chrome ring and rubber base vs the Dietz units used on the production cars with car #111 used as and example. The red arrow is pointing to the standard Mustang that was Lime Gold at the photo shot and was a much different (correct) shade than the color of the Shelby which had an odd cast to it.
Here is another of the Lucas version (from England) as they were used on many English cars such as Allards.
Here too are a couple more of Daytona Coupes with the Lucas Lights.
It's probably good at this time to point out that these are most times incorrectly referred to as "Marker Lights" which they are not. Those were mandated in '68 in the US and come on with the Parking lights front and rear sides and were not allowed to be over a specified height on the sides of the cars.
In meeting notes and early sales literature these are referred by Shelby American as "eye level brake and turn indictor lights" as that was their function - a safety feature that was thought to have been inspired by the lights used in 24 Hour races such as LeMans for helping to identify cars from the pits as they passed by at night. The use of the scoops were also from the GT40's used at LeMans which were being built below the second story offices where Chuck McHose was designing the unique features that would be used on the '67's.
The lights although having a safety factor and unique appearance were deemed illegal in many states that had laws stating that only Police, Safety and emergency vehicles could have flashing red lights anywhere other than the tail lights on a vehicle. A detail the Shelby crew never thought of or and idea they never thought to run past any motor vehicle organization.
When Fred Goodell from Ford was sent to help out production at Shelby in late 1966 he was taken to task when he had to go to Sacramento on matters and was cornered by the state motor officials for these lights and the center mounted Inboard high-beam (not driving lights) in the grilles as there was also a minimum distance between headlights law in California and many other states. The result is that on his return the upper scoop lights and the inboard grille lights were on the short list to modify or stop doing. Hence the cut-off date for the upper scoop lights in end of December with some cars spilling over to early January.
The light units that were implemented for production were a common part that was also being used among other places as clearance lights on trailers for trucking companies. The brand was Dietz there were a few models but one was used for the '67 Shelby's. (There is a version that has side shields to help protect the lenses - top inset of attached image) The units could be had with clear, amber or red lenses and the Shelby's got the red. (over the years some guys have substituted amber lenses but these were not use on the production cars)
The body of the light was embedded towards the rear in the back of the upper scoop and a ground wire was attached to the body of the light and the other end to the body of the car. A jumper wire was attached to the hot lead on the light unit and tapped into the brake/turn/flashers back at the tail end of the car where the Shelby Cougar light also were spliced into the stock Ford Mustang wire loom. The stock Mustang had two bulbs to run the early Shelby's taxed the system with eight!
Over the years these lights have remained available at auto parts stores around the US for very little money. There are people that list them (daily) on e-Pay for insane amounts of money.
Since they have been for sale soo long and the company changed ownership there are a number of variations. Some of the variations are not seen once the lights are installed/embedded in the fiberglass scoop. The part that does show is the lens. There seem to be five variations to the lenses, and one that is viewed as "assembly line correct".
The originals have the Dietz "DZ" on a oval molded onto the lens along with the model number "77-823" below it.
There is another version that also has four "nubs" at the perimeter but these are believed to be later versions.
There is a version with "SER-DO" and "K-101" and "SAE-P-65" molded onto the lens below it.
There is another version that also has four "nubs" at the perimeter but these have "SIGNAL-STAT" and "77-823" below it molded into the lens, also a later version.
The last (?) version does not have anything molded into the dome of the lens but along the perimeter is "LS-310" and opposite it on the lip is typically a single number which may be a mold number.
Great Job as always JD.
Guys, I own 0194 which has a build date Dec ' 66' . I had talked to the guy who restored the car the 2nd time and he said that when he got in the restoration that the original holes were filled in with Bondo and that the wire harness was tucked behind the sail panel. The reason I asked this question is that on the list it states the lights were added by the owner. I just wanted to clarify the info given and weather the car came from the factory with the side maker lights. I believe it did . Any help on this. Thanks Steve
Quote from: Steve Z on February 02, 2018, 03:20:31 PM
Guys, I own 0194 which has a build date Dec ' 66' . I had talked to the guy who restored the car the 2nd time and he said that when he got in the restoration that the original holes were filled in with Bondo and that the wire harness was tucked behind the sail panel. The reason I asked this question is that on the list it states the lights were added by the owner. I just wanted to clarify the info given and weather the car came from the factory with the side maker lights. I believe it did . Any help on this. Thanks Steve
Hi Steve,
Thanks for posting about #0194. Since the scoop lights were an added component by Shelby, we really need to look at the Shelby American (SA) build date 1/5/67, not the San Jose (SJ) build date 12/10/66. January is a bit late for an upper scoop light car. Another consideration is the majority of upper scoop light cars are from before your DSO 84-2528. The note on our list was based on the above and also the photos of your car showing incorrect scoop lights. The wiring may have been added by the owner who put on those incorrect lights. It is possible the wiring was factory installed and not connected.
I'm not here to say your right or wrong, just wanted you to be aware of why we noted it as such. Do you have any photos of the 2nd restoration that show the wiring and connection or the scoops (I know that's a slim chance), it might help.
Rich, I had a chance to go back thru the restoration photos , but nothing showed up in the pics. No help there, so I can't say for sure. Thanks Steve
Not bragging but I've been saying for years it has been less than 200, more likely 180 or so with the scoop lights.
And yes, some dope let the word out to Ward Auto Supply that "these fit the 67'Shelby" so they raised the price.
new updates made to list;
#208 GT500 No
#211 GT500 No
I just found something pretty interesting. Im not sure if it's been mentioned here before or not. If so, I apologize. Car 43, a recently beautifully restored early nightmist car popped up on my radar screen, but for another reason I will explain soon. But anyway, I received this picture of the restored car and quickly noticed that it doesn't have USL's. What gives? it's Shelby competition date was 11/11/66. Scoops were never removed before, and no sign of the lights at the restoration. I spoke with the 67 registrar who told me there were other cars completed in Nov that didn't receive them. I honestly thought that it was safe to assume that all cars completed up to the end of November received this feature, but obviously I have no idea what I'm talking about. Thoughts?
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/196-250618124019.jpeg)
Yes, there are some double-digit cars that seem to have never had them - there's just not rhyme or reason on these dang '67's.
Brian,
Thanks for posting the photo of #0043 (If you have any other photos of it please let me know). Personally, I think it highly respectable that the owner / restorer did not add the scoop lights during the restoration even though they might have been tempted too..
Yes, there are a few double digit cars without the Upper Scoop Lights for one reason or another. One or two can be explained by the SA build completion date, but the others like #0043 are a bit of a mystery.
From what I've seen the Upper Scoop Lights were installed on these cars until approximately early to mid December. We can't nail down the exact date since the cars were not started and completed in order. By the VIN, they get a bit scattered starting in the 150's. (In my opinion, they end in the late 150's with one or two exceptions; #176 the Lime Gold GT350 Brochure car being one of them (a September 66 SA build). Anything after this time or VIN is highly questionable, but you just never know.)
The Upper Scoop Lights would likely have been installed early in the build process. Some cars may have been started upon arrival at LAX, but not finished until weeks later as noted by the SA / SJ dates. Other cars may have been started and completed in a few days (perhaps these mystery November cars). We know there are some cars that had the wiring installed, but had no signs of the lights, in the original scoops, were found during their restorations. At least one car is known where a later owner added the scoop lights because of existing wiring. The temptation was too strong to resist.
Just one more of those pesky '67 changes through the production run...
What did the wiring look like? Was there an actual harness or just a couple of Scotch-Locks and wire?
Quote from: KR Convertible on June 25, 2018, 02:10:58 PM
What did the wiring look like? Was there an actual harness or just a couple of Scotch-Locks and wire?
Yes, basically that was what was done for the "feed signal", also a ground wire for the light unit was added, not Scotch-lock. (look at the 3rd image in Reply 3 of this thread)
I'm not sure if I posted this before.
Here's an unidentified Nightmist Blue GT350 that popped up in 2010 in Michigan. Noted as the "Ford and Mustang Birch Run".
Perhaps someone might know the Shelby Vin by the unique (different year) fender emblem.
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/204-110718223950.jpeg)
(http://www.saacforum.com/gallery/204-110718224904.jpeg)
Here's a question I've never seen asked before. Is there any record of a car having small red lights on the inside of the car that light up at the appropriate times that the out side USL's were supposed to? I was looking at a car recently that the owner says has the wiring for the USL's but the lights aren't there. There are just these little lights on the inside of the car in the rear vent piece. The car has an early January build date, the owner has had it since around 1980. There were USL's in the trunk when he bought it and he assumed this car was supposed to have them.
Quote from: owenkelley on August 20, 2018, 09:57:19 PM
Here's a question I've never seen asked before. Is there any record of a car having small red lights on the inside of the car that light up at the appropriate times that the out side USL's were supposed to? I was looking at a car recently that the owner says has the wiring for the USL's but the lights aren't there. There are just these little lights on the inside of the car in the rear vent piece. The car has an early January build date, the owner has had it since around 1980. There were USL's in the trunk when he bought it and he assumed this car was supposed to have them.
I am very skeptical about any lights on the inside . Disregard the fact that I have never seen one with them in the large number that I have seen during personal observations, requested by enthusiast car evaluations and judging venues but it doesn't even make sense from a functional standpoint. What would the purpose be for lights located in the interior vent area to illuminate?
Quote from: owenkelley on August 20, 2018, 09:57:19 PM
Here's a question I've never seen asked before. Is there any record of a car having small red lights on the inside of the car that light up at the appropriate times that the out side USL's were supposed to? I was looking at a car recently that the owner says has the wiring for the USL's but the lights aren't there. There are just these little lights on the inside of the car in the rear vent piece. The car has an early January build date, the owner has had it since around 1980. There were USL's in the trunk when he bought it and he assumed this car was supposed to have them.
Not typical. Car number, state car was originally sold in and photos would be interesting.
Perhaps the car had the outside lights which were removed and the wiring was redirected to the added inside lights for some reason.
Quote from: Bob Gaines on August 20, 2018, 10:31:32 PM
Quote from: owenkelley on August 20, 2018, 09:57:19 PM
Here's a question I've never seen asked before. Is there any record of a car having small red lights on the inside of the car that light up at the appropriate times that the out side USL's were supposed to? I was looking at a car recently that the owner says has the wiring for the USL's but the lights aren't there. There are just these little lights on the inside of the car in the rear vent piece. The car has an early January build date, the owner has had it since around 1980. There were USL's in the trunk when he bought it and he assumed this car was supposed to have them.
I am very skeptical about any lights on the inside . Disregard the fact that I have never seen one with them in the large number that I have seen during personal observations, requested by enthusiast car evaluations and judging venues but it doesn't even make sense from a functional standpoint. What would the purpose be for lights located in the interior vent area to illuminate?
Bob, it was the '60s and maybe it gave the proper psychedelic vibe when you hit the brakes for the passengers in the back who were stoned. ;D
Quote from: JD on August 20, 2018, 10:38:34 PM
Quote from: owenkelley on August 20, 2018, 09:57:19 PM
Here's a question I've never seen asked before. Is there any record of a car having small red lights on the inside of the car that light up at the appropriate times that the out side USL's were supposed to? I was looking at a car recently that the owner says has the wiring for the USL's but the lights aren't there. There are just these little lights on the inside of the car in the rear vent piece. The car has an early January build date, the owner has had it since around 1980. There were USL's in the trunk when he bought it and he assumed this car was supposed to have them.
Not typical. Car number, state car was originally sold in and photos would be interesting.
Perhaps the car had the outside lights which were removed and the wiring was redirected to the added inside lights for some reason.
I'm betting no one has seen or heard of anything like that before. It would definitely help us to know the Shelby VIN number. When it was built at San Jose is another factor to consider. As JD said, do you have any pictures you can share with us.
Quote from: BGlover67 on August 20, 2018, 10:45:51 PM
Quote from: Bob Gaines on August 20, 2018, 10:31:32 PM
Quote from: owenkelley on August 20, 2018, 09:57:19 PM
Here's a question I've never seen asked before. Is there any record of a car having small red lights on the inside of the car that light up at the appropriate times that the out side USL's were supposed to? I was looking at a car recently that the owner says has the wiring for the USL's but the lights aren't there. There are just these little lights on the inside of the car in the rear vent piece. The car has an early January build date, the owner has had it since around 1980. There were USL's in the trunk when he bought it and he assumed this car was supposed to have them.
I am very skeptical about any lights on the inside . Disregard the fact that I have never seen one with them in the large number that I have seen during personal observations, requested by enthusiast car evaluations and judging venues but it doesn't even make sense from a functional standpoint. What would the purpose be for lights located in the interior vent area to illuminate?
:)
Bob, it was the '60s and maybe it gave the proper psychedelic vibe when you hit the brakes for the passengers in the back who were stoned. ;D
I know that there was a listing of 350 & 500 USL cars on the old forum, I have that saved in my files, but was there a colour breakdown posted any where of the USL cars ? I know I could go too my registry ::)
Mike
Quote from: honker on October 29, 2018, 08:36:47 PM
I know that there was a listing of 350 & 500 USL cars on the old forum, I have that saved in my files, but was there a colour breakdown posted any where of the USL cars ? I know I could go too my registry ::)
Mike
I don't recall seeing a color breakdown. I have an excel spreadsheet that highlights each VIN number by paint color.
Anything in particular you wanted to know?
Rich, thanks for your reply, interested in the colour break down just for my own curiosity.
Mike
I'll try to make a breakdown of the colors when I get a chance.
The difficultly is we don't know every single car with USLs, so there will be some guessing.
I can say for certain there were no Acapulco Blue cars with the scoop lights.
More than likely there were no Brittany Blue cars. (no on the 1 of 1 Yellow or 1 of 1 Burgundy either)
Definitely only 1 Red car, #0100 the GT500 (maybe the only GT500, not 100% certain on that yet).
Quote from: Richstang on October 30, 2018, 10:39:27 PM
I'll try to make a breakdown of the colors when I get a chance.
The difficultly is we don't know every single car with USLs, so there will be some guessing.
I can say for certain there were no Acapulco Blue cars with the scoop lights.
More than likely there were no Brittany Blue cars. (no on the 1 of 1 Yellow or 1 of 1 Burgundy either)
Definitely only 1 Red car, #0100 the GT500 (maybe the only GT500, not 100% certain on that yet).
Truer words were never spoken...
Quote from: BGlover67 on August 20, 2018, 10:45:51 PM
Quote from: Bob Gaines on August 20, 2018, 10:31:32 PM
Quote from: owenkelley on August 20, 2018, 09:57:19 PM
Here's a question I've never seen asked before. Is there any record of a car having small red lights on the inside of the car that light up at the appropriate times that the out side USL's were supposed to? I was looking at a car recently that the owner says has the wiring for the USL's but the lights aren't there. There are just these little lights on the inside of the car in the rear vent piece. The car has an early January build date, the owner has had it since around 1980. There were USL's in the trunk when he bought it and he assumed this car was supposed to have them.
I am very skeptical about any lights on the inside . Disregard the fact that I have never seen one with them in the large number that I have seen during personal observations, requested by enthusiast car evaluations and judging venues but it doesn't even make sense from a functional standpoint. What would the purpose be for lights located in the interior vent area to illuminate?
Bob, it was the '60s and maybe it gave the proper psychedelic vibe when you hit the brakes for the passengers in the back who were stoned. ;D
No, no, no! You had to be stoned first before you got into the rear seats to keep from panicking. The only rear seat worse is a 911.
I get panic attacks just thinking about putting any living creature back there. I need some cava-cava now.
In the 2011 registry on page 784, there is a short article on the Upper Scoop Lights. It includes information from an internal Shelby American memo (dated December 2nd, 1966). It noted the USLs were to be deleted from the '67 Shelby's from that point forward, unless the cars were already underway for that feature.
I'd assume any car built by San Jose on or after 12/2/66 would NOT have the USLs, since they didn't even arrive at LAX before the written memo.
Update the list on page 1 in reply #3 with #0147 as YES.
Quote from: Richstang on October 30, 2018, 10:39:27 PM
I'll try to make a breakdown of the colors when I get a chance.
The difficultly is we don't know every single car with USLs, so there will be some guessing.
I can say for certain there were no Acapulco Blue cars with the scoop lights.
More than likely there were no Brittany Blue cars. (no on the 1 of 1 Yellow or 1 of 1 Burgundy either)
Definitely only 1 Red car, #0100 the GT500 (maybe the only GT500, not 100% certain on that yet).
Here is another Red GT500 - and NOT 100...... Happy New Year to all. 8) 8) 8)
Lowell's Car? It looks to be from that famous shoot of V-738-2.
Definitely 0195 is a no!
Quote from: BGlover67 on December 31, 2020, 08:02:58 PM
Lowell's Car? It looks to be from that famous shoot of V-738-2.
Yes, that's certainly Lowell's car from the Sid Avery photo shoot in late September 1966.
In reply #3, we re-established both #00176 and V-738-2 (completed for marketing purposes for both '67 models) received the non production upper scoop lights. I also agree those light assemblies were likely from a Daytona Coupe.
My hope is to draw out owners of production units, as we continue to search for early '67's that might have had the upper scoop lights, not on our established list.
We're still looking for any cars with Upper Scoop Lights.
No cars after Shelby VIN #00158 have been confirmed as having them..
A Confidential internal SAI letter notes the cut off from SHELBY AMERICAN was 12/2/1966.
Only cars already started at that point would be finished with them.
There were also several cars completed before #00158 that did not get them
(certainly not #00131 the hardtop or #00139 the convertible)
The total number of USL's is very close to around 150 cars.
Thanks man. I didn't get to read the comment on my For Sale post. I thought you had told me it was somewhere around 150, so when the other gentleman wrote about there being 170 something I knew we had a discrepancy.
Clearing up my files ::) I came across this post I saved off some Shelby/Mustang ? forum.
Any know more regarding this law in PA ?
Mike
#2928 has upper scoop marker lights. They were in place when I adopted the car from my boss in '81.
When I did a restore/repaint years ago I was told by people here that know, that the lights were installed
the same way they were installed on the early cars and help me get the correct lenses.
No documentation on who or when they were installed.
upper scoop marker eye level brake and turn lights
Can confirm that # 0195 did not have them. Restored taking to metal with no wiring etc!