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Messages - SFM66H

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CSX 3000 Series / Re: COBRA 427 Article
« on: May 09, 2020, 09:30:00 PM »
Iíve gotten PMís & comments about the Cobra picture in this article, but nothing about my original question. I KNOW itís not a 427 Cobra, itís CSX2513, the CS School of High Performance Driving car. That has nothing to do with my question, Iím just asking for the name of the magazine that this article was in, and which issue it was.

Does anyone have the cover of the magazine that this article was in? I didnít save it back in the day because it didnít seem important. But now I sure would like to know what magazine this was published in. All three pages of the article have no information except the page number!

CSX 3000 Series / COBRA 427 Article
« on: May 09, 2020, 05:57:22 PM »
Can someone please tell me the name and date of the magazine that this COBRA 427 article was in?

There's also a page 32 with half text and half photos, and a pg 33 with all photos.


George through Kieth:
Just cannot thank you both enough for George sharing and Kieth for bringing to us this absolutely essential SAI history. The former (now lost) thread was IMO the biggest singular treasure lost. To whatever degree any parts of it can be reconstituted, and saved, is of incalculable value to our hobby for us and those who follow.
We are almost down to sole-source contacts for this type of original or near-original attributable information.

Steve A

Steve A,

Thanks for the kind words, itís very nice to know that it meant so much to others too. Speaking for myself, the loss of the George Watters Collection had quite an impact on me. I really felt back then that all the time and effort we put into it was worth it because it would be there for posterity, you know? I saw it as our contribution to Shelby American history that could always be accessed by future generations. Yes, I realize now how naive that was. Itís what I call a harsh Ďlife lesson.í

Thank goodness I still have all the scanned photographs, but Georgeís words and the comments and reactions of the members are all lost. And those were as much a part of the story as the photos themselves. I got jaded by the loss of Forum 1.0 - you know, the old ďburn me onceĒ thing. Once enough time had passed though, I noticed that I would still get a spark of enthusiasm now and then, but I felt I had to rein it in. Itís not like Iím not sitting around pouting or anything - things happen, I get it. But I also donít find myself wanting to plunge in headfirst again on another full time effort like that either.

As you can see by our recent HPM1 post though, the excitement of a new discovery or revelation can still pull me right back into posting mode. But I keep at arms length to avoid another colossal disappointment like the last time.

Thanks for letting me vent. And again, much appreciation from George and I for all of your appreciative comments over the years. Itís something we all got to experience together here, and that was very cool. One thing that always keeps me excited though, is the proof from past experience knowledge that we are all going to see something new this year that we have never seen before. That has happened time and time again. Weíve ďseen it allĒ right? And then that French video of LAX falls out of the sky! THATís what keeps the fire lit for me.

I want to add here too, that despite the sad demise of 1.0, the SAAC Forum in and of itself is an incredible mechanism for sharing. I have learned so much from it that it is invaluable to me. And truth be told, I have acquired some of the closest friends I have thru it. Thatís an amazing thing to me, and proof of its value right there.

Thanks again,

PS - Oh, and Steve A, a VERY cool story about your 5S339, itís original owner and HPM 1. Thanks for sharing it. How would we all have ever learned that except thru this Forum?

Kieth, thanks for starting this thread, great story, I hope I'm not diverting from the thrust of the thread with my posts ?


Nope, no problem Mike. Itís all HPM, so itís all good!


HPM ad for the Tiger from a Riverside program '64.


Thanks Mike - George had a color version of this one as well!


I donít wish to sidetrack this, but doesnít George have a story involving the food truck at Shelby American? Maybe another topic could be created for that.


Oh boy Steve, that IS another cool story, isnít it? And the circumstances that brought it about is another epic tale of serendipity.

George and I would never want to bore members with stories they may have heard before, but as the years pass and newer members come aboard (and Forums crash :o) we also would not want to let those things pass into forgotten history either.

I shall approach George about it, and Thanks for the suggestion!


George also points out another salient observation about the two HPM dealerships.

HPM 1 on La Brea Ave. was named ďCarroll Shelby & Lew Spencerís Hi-Performance Motors, Inc.Ē but HPM 2 on Sepulveda Blvd. was named only ďCarroll Shelbyís Hi-Performance Motors, Inc.Ē

Thatís an easy detail to gloss over, but itís an important and interesting one, I think. Before I met George, what I knew about these dealerships wouldnít fill a thimble. Learning so much about them from him has been one of the most rewarding aspects in my quest for all things in Shelby American history!

George Watters and I were recently discussing Hi-Performance Motors' first dealership location and he reminded me that he had taken a few photos of it in December 1979. He then mailed the date stamped photos to me and I noticed that they included views of the side and the back of the building that probably very few people here had ever seen before. The middle view below is two photographs that I stitched together to show the entire length of the building from a 45 degree angle. I then noticed (for the first time) the 'little block house' on the left side of the building. One of his photos even showed the back door of it! His story had been printed in the Shelby American some time ago, but it did not include a photo of that block house on the side or the back door on it. It would really be amazing if anyone here may have some information on what that room was actually used for when the dealership was in this building. I felt that a retelling of this amazing story would be a real treat for newer members. I've told George that in my opinion, this story is actually an important piece of modern Shelby American history!

Also (for those who don't know) credit for designing the iconic HPM logo goes to Pete Brock. It is just one of his many brilliant designs.

Kieth Champine

Here are George's words about 'The Logo':

At the time (1979) I worked in Hollywood, not too far from the first Hi-Performance Motors dealership at 1150 S. La Brea Ave. I was curious to see if the building was still here. It had been 14 years since Shelby had moved to the new HPM 2 location on Sepulveda Blvd, which was right around the corner from the LAX factory on West Imperial Highway. As I drove up to the building, I was shocked to see that the original Hi-Performance Motors logo was still attached to the front of the building! Two sections of it were missing. The building had a FOR SALE sign on it and I wrote down the telephone number. When I got back to work I called it and explained to the man that answered the phone what had been at the location years before. He said, ďI own the building and I was the person that leased it to Carroll Shelby.Ē He said that he knew all about Shelby and his cars. He told me that he was probably going to tear the building down. I asked about the logo on the front of the building and he said he remembered when it went up. I asked if I could buy it for a couple hundred dollars and he said I could, as long as I took it down. I sent him a check. 
The following Sunday, early in the morning, I drove my í65 GT 350 #467 down and took a few pictures of the car under the logo. A couple of friends drove their pickup truck with some tools and a ladder and helped out. We backed the truck under the logo and put the ladder up. Unfortunately the logo was almost flush against the building and we could not get our tools in back of it. I got up on the roof of the building and leaned over but still could not get any of the logo off. The only thing left to do was to break it up into pieces. It was made out of a hard plastic so I took a hammer and broke it apart figuring that when I got home I could put back together like a puzzle, then glue it and make a backing to attach it to. When I got home, I spread it out and all of the pieces were there and did fit together. I figured that sometime in the future I would work on it. That sometime in the future never came. I put all of the pieces in one of the many large walk-in cabinets in my garage and forgot about it. 
It has now been 41 years since the original story appeared in the Shelby American, and over time I have been asked more than once about the sign, so I guess I should finish the story. Unfortunately, it does not have a good ending. Over the years it was never moved from its original location in the walk-in cabinet and things got put in front of it so nobody would have even known the pieces were there. Years later I moved and I was not the one that did the final walk thru in the garage cabinets to make sure that nothing was left behind. Unfortunately it was still there somewhere and whoever found it would have never known of its importance. Iím sure they figured it was just junk!

Note the two different colors of the logo still clearly visible on the building in George's photo, and as seen in this famous original ad for the first dealership:

In this small gray ad below, I added that light greenish color to the upper right of the logo. It was originally a black & white magazine ad, but I think it's so cool because it looks like a white contrail behind that 'rocket like' logo:

1965 GT350/R-Model / Re: R model ?
« on: April 16, 2020, 02:52:44 PM »

The San Jose build dates in the registry confirm they are all 5R09K chassis.

Images from the internet show 5R535 and 5R536 with a 66 grill. Assuming an accurate restorations, that will make 6 with a 66 grill.   In fact the last batch of 14 R-models all had San Jose start dates of 4-20-65, from 5R527 to 5R540.   Again from the registry 5R528 is also noted with a 66 grill and side strip.  Making seven confirmed 66 grills.   This would suggest all 14 R-models from 4-20-65 got the 66 grill and 66 side stripe.  At least half of them did.


George Watters states that 5R528 definitely came with a '66 grill, as shown in this original photo at Waterford Hills:

SAAC Forum Discussion Area / Re: Shelby license plate pics
« on: April 03, 2020, 05:49:11 PM »
For the first 40 years I owned my car, I had the plate GT 350H. I got so tired of people asking me "Does the "H" stand for HURST?", that in 2016 I had finally had enough and decided to take their ability to ask that question away from them...

...and I decided the best way to do that was to remove all speculation, and put the word HERTZ first.

Now what they ask me every single time is, "What year is that?"  :o     

1966 Shelby GT350/GT350H / Re: DOT 3 Synthetic Brake Fluid
« on: March 30, 2020, 12:17:54 AM »
Okay - Thanks for your responses!

1966 Shelby GT350/GT350H / DOT 3 Synthetic Brake Fluid
« on: March 29, 2020, 08:16:01 PM »
This thread is ONLY about DOT 3 brake fluid. If we get all the other types and numbers involved this will go off the rails. No silicone in this discussion please!

I just learned that all the DOT 3 brake fluid that I can find right now is synthetic. Can DOT 3 synthetic be mixed with the Ďregularí DOT 3 - the previous version that says nothing about being synthetic on the bottle?


1966 Shelby GT350/GT350H / Re: LeMans Cam Valve Lash
« on: March 29, 2020, 10:07:22 AM »
EXCELLENT - Thanks Royce!

1966 Shelby GT350/GT350H / Re: LeMans Cam Valve Lash
« on: March 28, 2020, 07:23:36 PM »

It's a little racier at idle then the 289 hp cam.

Lots of extra torque right off of idle. People will hear you comming and they stop and look. Greenpeace probably will hate you for it?

Thanks shelbydoug - you present very appealing characteristics of this cam. I would enjoy offending Greenpeace if at all possible. I'll run it past my builder for sure. He has already spoken to me of Comp Cams and this may have been the actual one he was referring to. I had LeMans cam blindness at the time...

Thanks again for all the time you have taken to help me with this quandary of mine,


1966 Shelby GT350/GT350H / Re: LeMans Cam Valve Lash
« on: March 28, 2020, 05:50:04 PM »
Oops, that would've helped, 'eh?

Street. Just a stock 1966 GT 350 4 speed...

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