Author Topic: Wonder if anyone can help. Rebuilding a T10  (Read 2067 times)

SFM6S087

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Re: Wonder if anyone can help. Rebuilding a T10
« Reply #45 on: July 15, 2019, 05:09:41 AM »
Thanks for the update. I'm sure I'm not the only one lurking on this thread hoping to learn something.

Steve

pmustang

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Re: Wonder if anyone can help. Rebuilding a T10
« Reply #46 on: July 15, 2019, 04:22:33 PM »
Thanks, not been back to work yet

The guy who built the trans doesn’t seem to excited to dig into it again.  I am sure it will need to go to someone else but giving him a shot

Will reveal the outcome when I know

pmustang

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Re: Wonder if anyone can help. Rebuilding a T10
« Reply #47 on: July 16, 2019, 06:13:13 PM »
Okay, Went to work today and the trans guy had the trans apart. I took a new (from the Scott drake kit) syncro and put it against the gear cone and gave it a twist with some pressure. Locked on it tight!

I am NO trans rebuilder so can't say that is definitely not how it should go but it sure locked on there tight.

So the trans guy lapped the syncros onto the gear cone with some lapping paste as suggested by an "expert" on you tube with a video about this very issue.

Trans will go back in tomorrow and hopefully the issue will be sorted. 

Cheers. Peter

pmustang

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Re: Wonder if anyone can help. Rebuilding a T10
« Reply #48 on: July 18, 2019, 01:40:20 AM »
Maybe not the answer you want to hear but I have thrown in the towel

I spoke to many folks, I tried several ideas (last being the lapping of the syncros onto the gear cones) changed the shifter mechanism, new clutch, still CRAP

I mean garbage. Stuck in 2nd, stuck in 3rd, then can't get a gear. nightmare

God knows the hours and money lost at this point so pulled another T10 from another car (and a toploader went into that car) so the car gets a known good T10

I don't know if it was the new syncros, the builder....just at a total loss

Harris Speedster

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Re: Wonder if anyone can help. Rebuilding a T10
« Reply #49 on: July 18, 2019, 09:37:56 AM »
I have followed along with this topic thread.
Very interesting problem.
Biggest problem I ever had with any T-10, was popping out of gear.
Seemed, if I recall correctly, popped out more so when letting off the gas.

To your issue;
Seems you have patiently taken all avenues of approach, bummer that it still is acting up.

My thoughts are quite basic about it.

You mentioned that you did take it back to the business / person that rebuilt it, correct ?
were the thrusts tolerances blue printed to spec ?
were any gears replaced?
Herein may be the problem?
Respectfully submitted,
John
Is this the first futuristic exotic in the world?
Size of an ac cobra, but built in 1935 !
https://www.autopuzzles.com/forum/features-stories-and-photos/harris-fwd-speedster-the-story/?PHPSESSID=v4pqtv6hep4ff4rvalrc9qsnj7

gt350hr

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Re: Wonder if anyone can help. Rebuilding a T10
« Reply #50 on: July 18, 2019, 11:08:54 AM »
 I'm sorry you aren't over here in the states as I know I can fix it. Sticking in gear has nothing to do with the brass. It should always pull back into neutral even if the brass was stuck onto the gear you were in. Putting it in neutral would free up all of the brass as the gears remain in motion but the output shaft isn't connected.
     Randy
Celebrating 44 years of drag racing 6S477 and no end in sight.

pmustang

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Re: Wonder if anyone can help. Rebuilding a T10
« Reply #51 on: July 18, 2019, 03:31:31 PM »
Hello John

Before touching it the gearbox was sweet,  both myself and the cars buyer drove it strongly and we both commented on how well it drove and shifted. 

The issue came when I drove t later a longer distance.  running at a set speed while in gear it would pop out.

Only parts replaced in the rebuild (gearbox looked near new inside) were the main layshaft needle bearings and the synchros

This guy rebuilds my Toploaders and each has been tip top. 

After the first jamming in gear incindent the gear box locked up, then it was taken apart again, synchros lapped, then it was even worse.  My business partner who is an engineer said he was amazed at the inner surfaces of the synchros,  pretty sharp edges

NOTE the gearbox guy is not a gearbox expert and doesn’t proport to be but is a Ford Engineer who builds race cars

Thanks for your comments

You mentioned that you did take it back to the business / person that rebuilt it, correct ?
were the thrusts tolerances blue printed to spec ?
were any gears replaced?
Herein may be the problem?
Respectfully submitted,
John
[/quote]
« Last Edit: Today at 03:03:01 AM by pmustang »

pmustang

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Re: Wonder if anyone can help. Rebuilding a T10
« Reply #52 on: July 18, 2019, 03:34:17 PM »
I'm sorry you aren't over here in the states as I know I can fix it. Sticking in gear has nothing to do with the brass. It should always pull back into neutral even if the brass was stuck onto the gear you were in. Putting it in neutral would free up all of the brass as the gears remain in motion but the output shaft isn't connected.
     Randy

Hello Randy, I am sure you could do it while sleeping...:-)

For me t was a financial (although my solution was quite expensive) and mental decision.  I researched, asked here, there and everywhere.  Labour to take the thing out twice...you know the score

I would love to know why this happened but at this point I have to walk away

Thanks for your assist on this

Mostly the box would stick in 2nd,  athe gear lever could be moved around and third and forth attempted but it would be stuck in second and then it would go bang, come out of gear  and third and forth would be selectable
« Last Edit: Today at 03:03:27 AM by pmustang »

Harris Speedster

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Re: Wonder if anyone can help. Rebuilding a T10
« Reply #53 on: July 18, 2019, 04:20:15 PM »
P mustang,
If a gear set had been replaced, perhaps the gear angle and cut was miscalculated by the manufacturer.
But beings no gears were replaced, that discounts that possible theory.
Is this the first futuristic exotic in the world?
Size of an ac cobra, but built in 1935 !
https://www.autopuzzles.com/forum/features-stories-and-photos/harris-fwd-speedster-the-story/?PHPSESSID=v4pqtv6hep4ff4rvalrc9qsnj7

pmustang

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Re: Wonder if anyone can help. Rebuilding a T10
« Reply #54 on: July 18, 2019, 05:25:02 PM »
So little was replaced I can only think....actually I can't think of what is wrong :-)

We had a strange issue with gears a while back, I had a car with a factory 9 inch rear. The existing ratio in the car was all wrong for the engines power. I purchased a complete 9 inch gear set from a guy here that was unused, in the original packaging and with all the gubbins to install. It was from Currie, The package had their return address and it was brand new. Sat on his shelf for quite some time, Unmarked, as new

I had a drag race garage install it and he called me and said it was machined wrong, he could not get it to leave a proper pattern. He is extremely well known for what he does so I have to trust his statement. Brand new gear supplied by a major rear end company and defective out of the box.

As mentioned, no gears swapped in this trans.

It has got to be something crazy simple as the box shifted perfectly before the synchros and needles were replaced
« Last Edit: Today at 03:04:28 AM by pmustang »

pmustang

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Re: Wonder if anyone can help. Rebuilding a T10
« Reply #55 on: July 19, 2019, 05:24:06 PM »
Only posting this to show when it rains it pours

So upon giving up on the T10 in the car it was decided to pull a T10 from a car we had in stock,

So the whole T10, shifter, Rods and shifter handle were transferred.

Drove the car today, pops out of 2nd and 3rd.

It is like a nightmare car.

I will be staying away from T10s in the future.

Cheers. Peter

pbf777

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Re: Wonder if anyone can help. Rebuilding a T10
« Reply #56 on: July 19, 2019, 08:25:05 PM »

Brand new gear supplied by a major rear end company and defective out of the box.


     That wouldn't be a first, I assure you!        :o


     Don't be turned off on B.W. T10's as they were a good transmission in their time.  And, here in the peanut gallery we all await your solution to your endeavor, as none of our knuckles are getting bruised in the process (where that popcorn icon thingy?). 

     As long as your having fun R & R ing transmissions, and you should be getting proficient at the task (always look at the bright side!) , and since you have the advantage of spares (what luck!), my I suggest taking the side shift side cover assembly from the second unit (that "pops" out of gear) and install on the first that gets stuck in 2nd gear, and test the function. Perhaps at least in this test one could rule out the shift mechanism anyway.     

     Unfortunately, the solution to the issue will require hands-on observation, and this makes it impossible for the solution to come from a forum, but perhaps some thought may be provided which may spark the investigation and solution, perhaps?       ???

     Scott.

     

     

pmustang

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Re: Wonder if anyone can help. Rebuilding a T10
« Reply #57 on: Today at 02:59:30 AM »
In the end the customer was extremely appreciative of my complete transparency from the get go with the issues. When he test drove the car it performed flawlessly and it was only after that it popped out of gear. To be fair the test drive was lots of up and down shifting without a continued run at one speed so when I drove it later it showed its issue. I went after an issue he was unaware of and he appreciated that I did. The issues that followed, god knows the cause but in the end he wants the car regardless of the dropping out of gear and I gave him the original and the replacement trans so he has something to sell to recoup any further costs

My main issue is that I still am clueless as to the issue with the first gearbox sticking.

The huge annoyance is 1) not being able to sort the issue
2) Not knowing what the issue is.

Cheers for sticking with me folks, I am sure I will have more "fun" in the future

Cheers. Peter

pmustang

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Re: Wonder if anyone can help. Rebuilding a T10
« Reply #58 on: Today at 03:05:15 AM »
I think I now know why my GT350 has a 5 speed an its original T10 is on the shelf :-)