Author Topic: Original Axle Limiting Cables  (Read 4166 times)

andric

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Re: Original Axle Limiting Cables
« Reply #15 on: February 12, 2018, 12:11:14 AM »
I contacted Bo about my cable that started this thread. My car is 5S256. I will try to attach some pictures of the cable I took off my car almost 40 years ago. The cable is 301/2 inches long and is 1/8 inches in diameter. The ferrule is clearly copper. What is interesting is the ends of the cable are cut at an angle and soldered. Makes it a lot easier to install in the ferrule. You can see at the top of the cable is bent from going through the eye bolt and the bottom of the cable is curved from going around the axle. Also, the washer is smaller than the reproduction cable kit. Rick

texas swede

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Re: Original Axle Limiting Cables
« Reply #16 on: February 12, 2018, 08:14:04 AM »
Hi Rick,
You beat me to posting the pictures. Yesterday, I couldn't access the Forum.
A very interesting topic in my opinion.
Texas Swede

gt350hr

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Re: Original Axle Limiting Cables
« Reply #17 on: February 12, 2018, 10:45:20 AM »
  6S477 still has it's original cables.  I'll try and get a look at what they are .  Can be inspected at SAAC 43.
Celebrating 44 years of drag racing 6S477 and no end in sight.

Bob Gaines

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Re: Original Axle Limiting Cables
« Reply #18 on: February 12, 2018, 11:57:11 AM »
The crimp on that locking sleeve is double crimped like I am used to seeing them . The single crimp on the previous posters picture is out of the ordinary.
Bob Gaines,Shelby Enthusiast, Shelby Collector , Shelby Concours judge SAAC,MCA,Mid America Shelby

GT350Lad

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Re: Original Axle Limiting Cables
« Reply #19 on: February 13, 2018, 10:51:20 PM »
Iíll have a look when my car comes back from painters and Iíll check with Karl who owns 281

Cheers
6S373

Bob Gaines

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Re: Original Axle Limiting Cables
« Reply #20 on: February 14, 2018, 12:00:16 AM »
I would also be interested in pictures of how a presumed original limiting cable is found in to help confirm genuine SA or not.  How it is looped is just as important the crimped sleeve to determine genuine or not . For instance the picture of the cut wire and crimped sleeve is interesting but that by itself makes it more difficult not knowing the context of how it was found. The single crimp is unusual which makes me skeptical. How it was looped or how it was not looped helps establish what is genuine and what is not. A picture of the limiting cables taken from underneath which includes the top and the bottom of the cable on a car that is at rest tells the tale IMO. I wonder if the copper crimp sleeves were always copper color or if plated some other finish. That might help explain how another variety could be mixed in without standing out. 
Bob Gaines,Shelby Enthusiast, Shelby Collector , Shelby Concours judge SAAC,MCA,Mid America Shelby

GT350AUS

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Re: Original Axle Limiting Cables
« Reply #21 on: February 14, 2018, 09:08:10 AM »
Just checked mine 6s705 has aluminium crimps

CharlesTurner

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Re: Original Axle Limiting Cables
« Reply #22 on: February 14, 2018, 10:56:57 AM »
I was also thinking if they were copper, they probably had a zinc coating.
Charles Turner
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andric

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Re: Original Axle Limiting Cables
« Reply #23 on: February 14, 2018, 11:08:24 AM »
Bob,    In your comment "is found in" my reply would be that you only have my word that I took it off my car. I don't have a picture of the cable when it was on the car. As far as how it was looped you can see in the deformity of the cable that one end of the cable had passed through the eyebolt attached to the body and the other end went around the axle. As far as the copper sleeve, it is clearly coper and doesn't appear to be plated.   I can't claim that the coper sleeve is original because I haven't owned the car from new. Maybe the originals broke and someone replaced the original cables and used copper sleeve. To me that is highly unlikely. I bought my car in March of 1980 and the car would have been 15 years old. The cables condition indicates to me that it would be about 15 years old which could make it original to the car. I just finished restoration of my car after 38 years and I am putting new cables on the car. I intend to use copper ferrules and will keep the old one to show anyone if they question my choice.  Rick

Bob Gaines

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Re: Original Axle Limiting Cables
« Reply #24 on: February 14, 2018, 11:49:58 AM »
Bob,    In your comment "is found in" my reply would be that you only have my word that I took it off my car. I don't have a picture of the cable when it was on the car. As far as how it was looped you can see in the deformity of the cable that one end of the cable had passed through the eyebolt attached to the body and the other end went around the axle. As far as the copper sleeve, it is clearly coper and doesn't appear to be plated.   I can't claim that the coper sleeve is original because I haven't owned the car from new. Maybe the originals broke and someone replaced the original cables and used copper sleeve. To me that is highly unlikely. I bought my car in March of 1980 and the car would have been 15 years old. The cables condition indicates to me that it would be about 15 years old which could make it original to the car. I just finished restoration of my car after 38 years and I am putting new cables on the car. I intend to use copper ferrules and will keep the old one to show anyone if they question my choice.  Rick
Many owners are very protective of their car. It is like talking about their wife or kids. Many owners assume by default that everything on their car is factory original. There are times when they are not. Just because a honorable person thinks something is original on their car doesn't make it automatically so. When something out of the ordinary is discussed it helps others accept it better with additional evidence like pictures etc. instead of just relying on a memory and words.  As I explained in a previous post that the wire with the copper crimped sleeve being removed takes it out of context for helping establish how original it is . That is what I meant. I believe you took it off the car . I believe that you believe it is original to your car . I just need something more to help me believe your point of view in regards to its originality.  I just want to establish the truth what ever that might be. That is not something I take lightly . If it is it is . If it isn't it isn't. From your comment it seems you don't understand my reference to how it is looped. How it was looped is more then going through the eyelet and around the axle tube as you imply. If that is all you think there is then you don't know what you don't know. If the loop was installed wrong it would mean (for example) that the sleeve was most likely a replacement of some kind . Conversely if it was installed correctly it helps establish ( a replacement could also be installed correctly) the possibility that it may be some kind of alternate part used. We will never know in your case because the part is taken out of context. Do what you think is right for you . I am learning new things about these cars all of the time .  It may be just as you say but don't be upset at me for wanting a little more proof before changing my point of view on the subject  .
« Last Edit: February 14, 2018, 11:51:42 AM by Bob Gaines »
Bob Gaines,Shelby Enthusiast, Shelby Collector , Shelby Concours judge SAAC,MCA,Mid America Shelby

gt350hr

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Re: Original Axle Limiting Cables
« Reply #25 on: February 14, 2018, 03:13:14 PM »
  Bob's point is well taken by "me". SAI was not FoMoCo.  They didn't order ten thousand cable clamps made to a Ford blueprint like Ford HAD to do.  It was " hey we need some more cable clamps".  That "purchase" might or might not be the EXACT same ones as the last "purchase". There certainly WERE "blueprint manufactured " parts , and there may even be a blueprint on the cable design!  We are talking about 13 to 1400 cars that have them . The chances of variations are as real as the variations among the cars in general. "ONE " guy didn't do them all so there are "personal" variations too. Long term ownership of unmolested cars can provide . Commonality to "ranges" of cars  can be looked at to establish if the were in fact all the same or not. I will try to remember to get pictures of my originals tonight on 6S477 . Then I will take on the challenge of posting them , something a ten year old could do in less than a minute and I could take days!
Celebrating 44 years of drag racing 6S477 and no end in sight.

J_Speegle

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Re: Original Axle Limiting Cables
« Reply #26 on: February 14, 2018, 04:31:39 PM »
................ Commonality to "ranges" of cars  can be looked at to establish if the were in fact all the same or not. I will try to remember to get pictures of my originals tonight on 6S477 .

+1 If they did run out of something the worker wasn't sent down the street to buy enough for a single car or even likely a dozen of items. This sub patterns can be documented and the discovery of prior owner changes uncovered


Then I will take on the challenge of posting them , something a ten year old could do in less than a minute and I could take days!

Can always send them over by email and I can host and post  :)
Jeff Speegle- Mustang & Shelby detail collector, ConcoursMustang.com babysitter :) and Judge

andric

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Re: Original Axle Limiting Cables
« Reply #27 on: February 14, 2018, 05:17:54 PM »
6S477 would you look at the ends of your cables. Are they cut diagonally or at an angle. And if they were soldered.

march66

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Re: Original Axle Limiting Cables
« Reply #28 on: February 14, 2018, 06:00:47 PM »
I submitted the photos of the axle limiting cable with the single crimp copper ferrule and taken from 6S299.
 
After reading the following discussion and studying my saved cable, it appears the cable ends were soldered or melted together. No cable frays exist.

As said before, I had assumed the ferrule was aluminum until one day I notice what looked like a tinge of copper. Using some steel wool, I confirmed it was indeed copper.

While it is possible the ferrule could have had a protective coating covering the copper, it doesn't appear to be the case. Simply tarnished copper and road debris is what appears to me.

I always assumed the cables were original since I removed them in 1999 and knew the car history from the 70's.  Still, I respect what Bob Gaines says about necessary proof. I saved what I thought was important at the time, removed the cables from the context of things. Now, I can only offer what might contribute to solving a puzzle.

It will interesting to learn more from others.

Gary C. Bergman

Bob Gaines

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Re: Original Axle Limiting Cables
« Reply #29 on: February 15, 2018, 04:11:54 PM »
I received some pictures from Randy G. aka gt350hr to post . In the pictures it shows the crimped sleeve on the cable. Randy says it is turning green (which indicates copper). Randy says these have never been off of the housing. The one time he removed the housing , he did so by removing the upper eye bolts from the body he says.  The loop is not in the factory configuration of a figure eight but in a single loop (with the washer always in the middle) . The limiting cables are supposed to be installed in a figure eight at SA. I was hoping to see them in a figure eight to make it more apparent that the copper crimped sleeve was still in a factory configuration. The fact that they are not done that way may be do to when he took them off by unbolting the eyebolt and then when putting the eyebolt back on it twisted in a way allowing the cable to be in a single loop . When I ask Randy about it is says,"I am 100% positive I DID take them out of the figure 8 condition to eliminate  potential binding because of the drag race rear leaves I installed." That explains that.   That is 3 now that had the copper crimped sleeves and it has become more apparent that the copper style is a probable alternate fastener.
Bob Gaines,Shelby Enthusiast, Shelby Collector , Shelby Concours judge SAAC,MCA,Mid America Shelby