Author Topic: Out of my wheel house/ trans-am  (Read 703 times)

Bob Gaines

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Re: Out of my wheel house/ trans-am
« Reply #15 on: May 14, 2019, 02:45:01 PM »
;D

Looks like 67 K-H four piston front Mustang calipers to me?

The adapter is probably just 1/4" steel plate bolted in place of the drum backing plates? Everyone just presumes that it was taken off of an existing production vehicle but it's simpler to use a piece of plate steel in many cases.

The front adapter was a Kar Kraft part machined for the application out of a piece of billet steel.

As a previous request of the OP, I'll refrain from mentioning Concourse correct parts.
Doug ,no denying that the 67 Mustang front calipers also worked as I mentioned in my previous post.I believe the single piston was used for the majority of the 68 ,69 and 70 TA cars .
Bob Gaines,Shelby Enthusiast, Shelby Collector , Shelby Concours judge SAAC,MCA,Mid America Shelby

Coralsnake

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Re: Out of my wheel house/ trans-am
« Reply #16 on: May 14, 2019, 03:15:56 PM »
The bracket looks similar to the 65 front disc brake part.



« Last Edit: May 14, 2019, 03:18:38 PM by Coralsnake »
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shelbydoug

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Re: Out of my wheel house/ trans-am
« Reply #17 on: May 14, 2019, 04:17:32 PM »
;D

Looks like 67 K-H four piston front Mustang calipers to me?

The adapter is probably just 1/4" steel plate bolted in place of the drum backing plates? Everyone just presumes that it was taken off of an existing production vehicle but it's simpler to use a piece of plate steel in many cases.

The front adapter was a Kar Kraft part machined for the application out of a piece of billet steel.

As a previous request of the OP, I'll refrain from mentioning Concourse correct parts.
Doug ,no denying that the 67 Mustang front calipers also worked as I mentioned in my previous post.I believe the single piston was used for the majority of the 68 ,69 and 70 TA cars .

You need to qualify what T/A cars you are talking about. There are only  two '68 Shelby cars. The ones that were renumbered to show the Tunnel Port, engine code D, and a 68 production.

One of them is in that picture and it clearly shows a '67 4 piston caliper. The other car is called a "backup car" and really is the sister car to the Titus car.

If we're talking Bud Moore or someone else, I wouldn't know what they ran.

I suppose it all depends on what was homologated for them?

The '69 Boss 302 Chassis Book(let) is showing the "big Ford" front calipers and pretty sure, 67 Mustang fronts on the rear?

It doesn't really matter to me. I've got no dog in this race but as far as making a comment about "pretty much documented", ok. Where? Is there a secret document book somewhere?  ;D

TransamEd

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Re: Out of my wheel house/ trans-am
« Reply #18 on: May 14, 2019, 05:20:33 PM »
Found in my archive a pic of the other cars rear set-up in CAR LIFE Nov 68 (yellow car, red #1 Titus car is pictured as well in that article).



Bob Gaines

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Re: Out of my wheel house/ trans-am
« Reply #19 on: May 14, 2019, 06:01:11 PM »
;D

Looks like 67 K-H four piston front Mustang calipers to me?

The adapter is probably just 1/4" steel plate bolted in place of the drum backing plates? Everyone just presumes that it was taken off of an existing production vehicle but it's simpler to use a piece of plate steel in many cases.

The front adapter was a Kar Kraft part machined for the application out of a piece of billet steel.

As a previous request of the OP, I'll refrain from mentioning Concourse correct parts.
Doug ,no denying that the 67 Mustang front calipers also worked as I mentioned in my previous post.I believe the single piston was used for the majority of the 68 ,69 and 70 TA cars .

You need to qualify what T/A cars you are talking about. There are only  two '68 Shelby cars. The ones that were renumbered to show the Tunnel Port, engine code D, and a 68 production.

One of them is in that picture and it clearly shows a '67 4 piston caliper. The other car is called a "backup car" and really is the sister car to the Titus car.

If we're talking Bud Moore or someone else, I wouldn't know what they ran.

I suppose it all depends on what was homologated for them?

The '69 Boss 302 Chassis Book(let) is showing the "big Ford" front calipers and pretty sure, 67 Mustang fronts on the rear?

It doesn't really matter to me. I've got no dog in this race but as far as making a comment about "pretty much documented", ok. Where? Is there a secret document book somewhere?  ;D
]I might be remembering the Boss 302 TA sheet. My 68 TA car #5 was restored with the 4 piston brakes in the rear. This makes me feel better as I thought the 4 piston ones on the car  were out of place .  http://www.ponysite.de/67_68_notchbacks.htm
Bob Gaines,Shelby Enthusiast, Shelby Collector , Shelby Concours judge SAAC,MCA,Mid America Shelby

shelbydoug

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Re: Out of my wheel house/ trans-am
« Reply #20 on: May 14, 2019, 07:33:25 PM »
;D

Looks like 67 K-H four piston front Mustang calipers to me?

The adapter is probably just 1/4" steel plate bolted in place of the drum backing plates? Everyone just presumes that it was taken off of an existing production vehicle but it's simpler to use a piece of plate steel in many cases.

The front adapter was a Kar Kraft part machined for the application out of a piece of billet steel.

As a previous request of the OP, I'll refrain from mentioning Concourse correct parts.
Doug ,no denying that the 67 Mustang front calipers also worked as I mentioned in my previous post.I believe the single piston was used for the majority of the 68 ,69 and 70 TA cars .

You need to qualify what T/A cars you are talking about. There are only  two '68 Shelby cars. The ones that were renumbered to show the Tunnel Port, engine code D, and a 68 production.

One of them is in that picture and it clearly shows a '67 4 piston caliper. The other car is called a "backup car" and really is the sister car to the Titus car.

If we're talking Bud Moore or someone else, I wouldn't know what they ran.

I suppose it all depends on what was homologated for them?

The '69 Boss 302 Chassis Book(let) is showing the "big Ford" front calipers and pretty sure, 67 Mustang fronts on the rear?

It doesn't really matter to me. I've got no dog in this race but as far as making a comment about "pretty much documented", ok. Where? Is there a secret document book somewhere?  ;D
]I might be remembering the Boss 302 TA sheet. My 68 TA car #5 was restored with the 4 piston brakes in the rear. This makes me feel better as I thought the 4 piston ones on the car  were out of place .  http://www.ponysite.de/67_68_notchbacks.htm

According to spec sheet Trans Ed posted, the rear discs were optional. So why should anything to do with Shelby cars be easy or not full of asterisks? I think I'd rather have the drums. Rear discs are a Royal PITA. On a club racer like these T/A cars you don't have enough time to screw with everything on the car. Least of all, tempermental rear discs?

Mr.Guts

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Re: Out of my wheel house/ trans-am
« Reply #21 on: May 14, 2019, 08:28:07 PM »
;D

Looks like 67 K-H four piston front Mustang calipers to me?

The adapter is probably just 1/4" steel plate bolted in place of the drum backing plates? Everyone just presumes that it was taken off of an existing production vehicle but it's simpler to use a piece of plate steel in many cases.

The front adapter was a Kar Kraft part machined for the application out of a piece of billet steel.

As a previous request of the OP, I'll refrain from mentioning Concourse correct parts.
Doug ,no denying that the 67 Mustang front calipers also worked as I mentioned in my previous post.I believe the single piston was used for the majority of the 68 ,69 and 70 TA cars .

You need to qualify what T/A cars you are talking about. There are only  two '68 Shelby cars. The ones that were renumbered to show the Tunnel Port, engine code D, and a 68 production.

One of them is in that picture and it clearly shows a '67 4 piston caliper. The other car is called a "backup car" and really is the sister car to the Titus car.

If we're talking Bud Moore or someone else, I wouldn't know what they ran.

I suppose it all depends on what was homologated for them?

The '69 Boss 302 Chassis Book(let) is showing the "big Ford" front calipers and pretty sure, 67 Mustang fronts on the rear?

It doesn't really matter to me. I've got no dog in this race but as far as making a comment about "pretty much documented", ok. Where? Is there a secret document book somewhere?  ;D
]I might be remembering the Boss 302 TA sheet. My 68 TA car #5 was restored with the 4 piston brakes in the rear. This makes me feel better as I thought the 4 piston ones on the car  were out of place .  http://www.ponysite.de/67_68_notchbacks.htm

According to spec sheet Trans Ed posted, the rear discs were optional. So why should anything to do with Shelby cars be easy or not full of asterisks? I think I'd rather have the drums. Rear discs are a Royal PITA. On a club racer like these T/A cars you don't have enough time to screw with everything on the car. Least of all, tempermental rear discs?

Doug,

Would you care to expound on why you term a rear disc setup as "tempermental"?

Thank you,

Erik

gt350shelb

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Re: Out of my wheel house/ trans-am
« Reply #22 on: May 14, 2019, 10:46:25 PM »
the 4 piston front calipers on race cars were Lincoln/ with thunderbird  rotors  . Fia papes say a lot of things were legal but that is not the case / they show 10 inch wide wheels / among other things . 
Some where some one is driving their collector car for the last time but they don't know it . Drive your car every time like it could be the last memory of it .

shelbydoug

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Re: Out of my wheel house/ trans-am
« Reply #23 on: May 15, 2019, 07:14:56 AM »
;D

Looks like 67 K-H four piston front Mustang calipers to me?

The adapter is probably just 1/4" steel plate bolted in place of the drum backing plates? Everyone just presumes that it was taken off of an existing production vehicle but it's simpler to use a piece of plate steel in many cases.

The front adapter was a Kar Kraft part machined for the application out of a piece of billet steel.

As a previous request of the OP, I'll refrain from mentioning Concourse correct parts.
Doug ,no denying that the 67 Mustang front calipers also worked as I mentioned in my previous post.I believe the single piston was used for the majority of the 68 ,69 and 70 TA cars .

You need to qualify what T/A cars you are talking about. There are only  two '68 Shelby cars. The ones that were renumbered to show the Tunnel Port, engine code D, and a 68 production.

One of them is in that picture and it clearly shows a '67 4 piston caliper. The other car is called a "backup car" and really is the sister car to the Titus car.

If we're talking Bud Moore or someone else, I wouldn't know what they ran.

I suppose it all depends on what was homologated for them?

The '69 Boss 302 Chassis Book(let) is showing the "big Ford" front calipers and pretty sure, 67 Mustang fronts on the rear?

It doesn't really matter to me. I've got no dog in this race but as far as making a comment about "pretty much documented", ok. Where? Is there a secret document book somewhere?  ;D
]I might be remembering the Boss 302 TA sheet. My 68 TA car #5 was restored with the 4 piston brakes in the rear. This makes me feel better as I thought the 4 piston ones on the car  were out of place .  http://www.ponysite.de/67_68_notchbacks.htm

According to spec sheet Trans Ed posted, the rear discs were optional. So why should anything to do with Shelby cars be easy or not full of asterisks? I think I'd rather have the drums. Rear discs are a Royal PITA. On a club racer like these T/A cars you don't have enough time to screw with everything on the car. Least of all, tempermental rear discs?

Doug,

Would you care to expound on why you term a rear disc setup as "tempermental"?

Thank you,

Erik

I get uneven pad wear, pads often squeak and in my case because I use a parking brake, the parking brakes don't like to hold. Of course if you have an automatic transmission you don't really need a parking brake.  ;D

The main value seems to be on a car that continuously needs to brake hard from something like 150mph down to 20 or so in a long distance race like Lemans. In a 20 minute race there isn't a lot of advantage.

The drums are initially easier to set up parking brake wise. The big drums CAN be a PITA to get the original drag right. You wouldn't want to need to do that in a pit stop.

Having said that, certain disc bake calipers are much easier to drop in new pads under pit stop conditions then others. For one, the "big Lincoln" front calipers are almost like race calipers in that respect and they are just a larger version of the original K-H Mustang front calipers.


These brakes were really ultra-high-tech for the time but isn't that what these T/A cars are? If you want current high-tech, buy a new car. What's ironic though, except for some of the electronic gizmos and thing-a-ma-jigs, the cars are nearly the same?  Far-out-man! Right? Hippie Heaven. Peace! ;)
« Last Edit: May 15, 2019, 11:16:39 AM by shelbydoug »

gt350hr

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Re: Out of my wheel house/ trans-am
« Reply #24 on: May 15, 2019, 10:36:50 AM »
   Bob ,
    The predominant rear caliper was the '67 four piston through '69. For 1970 Bud tried some single piston stuff . What throws people off is the Boss 302 chassis book showed single piston stuff and the part numbers listed ( sale of leftover parts) were for that set up. The single piston stuff was not race worthy back then. There were some aluminum K/H "slider" ( as they were called back then) calipers made especially for Bud. '68 and 69 used Lincoln fronts and Mustang ( 4 piston ) rears.
     In '69 Shelby Racing Co switched to Hurst shifters but Bud stayed with Ford shifters until '70.
   Respectfully,
      Randy
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Bob Gaines

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Re: Out of my wheel house/ trans-am
« Reply #25 on: May 15, 2019, 01:56:59 PM »
   Bob ,
    The predominant rear caliper was the '67 four piston through '69. For 1970 Bud tried some single piston stuff . What throws people off is the Boss 302 chassis book showed single piston stuff and the part numbers listed ( sale of leftover parts) were for that set up. The single piston stuff was not race worthy back then. There were some aluminum K/H "slider" ( as they were called back then) calipers made especially for Bud. '68 and 69 used Lincoln fronts and Mustang ( 4 piston ) rears.
     In '69 Shelby Racing Co switched to Hurst shifters but Bud stayed with Ford shifters until '70.
   Respectfully,
      Randy
I stand corrected. Thanks.
Bob Gaines,Shelby Enthusiast, Shelby Collector , Shelby Concours judge SAAC,MCA,Mid America Shelby

shelbydoug

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Re: Out of my wheel house/ trans-am
« Reply #26 on: May 15, 2019, 01:59:13 PM »
   Bob ,
    The predominant rear caliper was the '67 four piston through '69. For 1970 Bud tried some single piston stuff . What throws people off is the Boss 302 chassis book showed single piston stuff and the part numbers listed ( sale of leftover parts) were for that set up. The single piston stuff was not race worthy back then. There were some aluminum K/H "slider" ( as they were called back then) calipers made especially for Bud. '68 and 69 used Lincoln fronts and Mustang ( 4 piston ) rears.
     In '69 Shelby Racing Co switched to Hurst shifters but Bud stayed with Ford shifters until '70.
   Respectfully,
      Randy
I stand corrected. Thanks.

There's like 3 cars that are 68s and 69s. You guys make it sound like there are dozens?

acman63

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Re: Out of my wheel house/ trans-am
« Reply #27 on: May 15, 2019, 02:20:49 PM »
   Bob ,
    The predominant rear caliper was the '67 four piston through '69. For 1970 Bud tried some single piston stuff . What throws people off is the Boss 302 chassis book showed single piston stuff and the part numbers listed ( sale of leftover parts) were for that set up. The single piston stuff was not race worthy back then. There were some aluminum K/H "slider" ( as they were called back then) calipers made especially for Bud. '68 and 69 used Lincoln fronts and Mustang ( 4 piston ) rears.
     In '69 Shelby Racing Co switched to Hurst shifters but Bud stayed with Ford shifters until '70.
   Respectfully,
      Randy
I stand corrected. Thanks.
I was at Bud Moores shop  maybe 25 years ago and they had crates full of NOS 69 shifters.  I bought what I needed at the time.  I didnt know at the time that they had a heat treat issue with the detent springs in these.  thats why they got loose and sloppy early on.  Bud probably put a new one in for each race
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