What style of brake duct tubing was originally used? How was it attached at either end by SA? I'm seeing pop rivets and what looks like hot glue.
My guess would be race car brake duct tubing with wire. But since they were in an airport SCAT or CAT tubing comes to mind (which looks about the same).
Quote from: Bossbill on September 07, 2020, 03:45:08 PM
What style of brake duct tubing was originally used? How was it attached at either end by SA? I'm seeing pop rivets and what looks like hot glue.
My guess would be race car brake duct tubing with wire. But since they were in an airport SCAT or CAT tubing comes to mind (which looks about the same).
Pop rivets. Hot glue was not typical from what I have seen.
I believe that the hose that was used was the duct for the defroster.
Not defroster duct, that duct's diameter was too small. It was some industrial grade duct that would be hard to find in todays light-weight world.
I thought on forum 1.0 somebody had sourced appropriate heavy gauge hose?
Quote from: roddster on September 08, 2020, 09:47:54 AM
Not defroster duct, that duct's diameter was too small. It was some industrial grade duct that would be hard to find in todays light-weight world.
That came from Dave Mathews. He said it was defroster duct which is why it rotted out so fast.
Mustang Defrost duct? That's 2 1/2" ID.
The brake cooling hose inlet is 3" OD.
Does it look like any of these?
Quote from: Bossbill on September 08, 2020, 06:52:55 PM
Mustang Defrost duct? That's 2 1/2" ID.
The brake cooling hose inlet is 3" OD.
Does it look like any of these?
3"? Not according to this. These are from my 3074, and LA. What part of China are yours from? ;)
I actually knocked a brake scoop loose a couple years ago and was kinda surprised how well they held up after all this time.Actually saved the scoop from falling all the way off.They were pop riveted...
Quote from: Bossbill on September 08, 2020, 06:52:55 PM
Mustang Defrost duct? That's 2 1/2" ID.
The brake cooling hose inlet is 3" OD.
Does it look like any of these?
The one on the far right most closely resembles the hose mentioned in that 1.0 thread.
Quote from: shelbydoug on September 08, 2020, 07:30:26 PM
Quote from: Bossbill on September 08, 2020, 06:52:55 PM
Mustang Defrost duct? That's 2 1/2" ID.
The brake cooling hose inlet is 3" OD.
Does it look like any of these?
3"? Not according to this. These are from my 3074, and LA. What part of China are yours from? ;)
Ok, now measure the outside.
Quote from: Bossbill on September 08, 2020, 10:25:20 PM
Quote from: shelbydoug on September 08, 2020, 07:30:26 PM
Quote from: Bossbill on September 08, 2020, 06:52:55 PM
Mustang Defrost duct? That's 2 1/2" ID.
The brake cooling hose inlet is 3" OD.
Does it look like any of these?
3"? Not according to this. These are from my 3074, and LA. What part of China are yours from? ;)
Ok, now measure the outside.
2-9/16". That isn't 3" unless you're maybe measuring with your toes?
You want it in millimeters and a signed and witnessed affidavit too?
Quote from: 2112 on September 08, 2020, 08:16:22 PM
The one on the far right most closely resembles the hose mentioned in that 1.0 thread.
Thanks. All of the above are [small] aircraft air ducting hose.
I have a NOS kit in the SA box which I bought at Hansen Racing in Sweden more than 40 years ago. He was the importer of Shelby stuff to Sweden and his shop is still around and run by his sons.
Unfortunately the hoses are too short (don't know why) so I bought some replacements that looks different.
Texas Swede Please note the hoses in the picture were the ones coming with the kit.
What are the dimensions OD , of the hose attachment pieces with your NOS parts?
The OD is about 2 15/16" and the ID of the hoses is 3". Also there is a plastic bag including 4 brackets with a screw in the middle
and 4 nuts which hold the plastic pieces in respective wheel well opening.
Texas Swede
3"? Not according to this. These are from my 3074, and LA. What part of China are yours from? ;)
These hoses are most definitely 3" ID in diameter. The side scoops start out at 2.75" but tapper to 3" where the rivets attach.
The hose is slightly different than other hoses I've used. It has a larger interior flat band that supports the insides, instead of a wire like most.
I really don't appreciate your comment about China. The newspaper used as packing material in the box is dared 1968
and I don't believe China made Shelby parts in the sixties.
Texas Swede
Here are some additional images from the crashed SAAC 1.0 Forum.
Swede did you post this similar photo of the scoop ducting on the green grass carpet?
Also, someone had posted this image of hose by Gates as a replacement option.
The images on old sheet were what was on the car I had, very early '67, show the rivets used to hold the hose to the plastic flanges.
Car #3074 would, to my knowledge, have been too late to have had ducted scoops from Shelby, owner/restorer added?
Yes, it iss my picture
Texas Swede
Quote from: JD on September 09, 2020, 09:00:38 AM
Here are some additional images from the crashed SAAC 1.0 Forum.
Swede did you post this similar photo of the scoop ducting on the green grass carpet?
Also, someone had posted this image of hose by Gates as a replacement option.
The images on old sheet were what was on the car I had, very early '67, show the rivets used to hold the hose to the plastic flanges.
Car #3074 would, to my knowledge, have been too late to have had ducted scoops from Shelby, owner/restorer added?
This is true JD but the scoops are original and the best fit for a hose to them would be a 2.75" ID. I suppose that you can use a 3" hose if you were ok with a loose fit?
Yes. 3074 has an interesting previous history as a race car by a chain of previous owners. It's like Captain Quint is in "Jaws", colorful. ;)
I'm not a chemist and can't analyze the original materials used for the ducting. I am repeating an answer to a question that I asked Dave Mathews about. I am sharing that here with the "community". That's all.
Even so, what's the big deal with what the hose has to be made of? It's a concealed part and the most important thing is never having to disassemble the car again to replace it. It ain't exactly easy to get at. Whatever the original hose was, it was not a very good application since it so quickly deteriorated.
It's interesting JD that the picture that you posted of the "original duct hose" has the same tears in the fabric that I am familiar with. The term Dave used was "rotted out". ;)
I have a repro scoop here from Branda and the molded in duct flange on that one is definitely different and definitely uses a 3" id hose.
So possibly that's where some of the confusion could be from?
Look, I'm not telling anyone what to do. That's up to them. I can just report on what I have.
I know of someone else that when he hears of something that he doesn't like claims it's "fake news"?
Some of you just can't let a day go buy without a good argument and Coralsnake isn't even involved in that? ;)
As far as you go Swede, if you are referring to my post about China and the source of Bill's scoop, show me where there is any mention of your kit by me?
Swedish and Texan? I hope you never get a hold of a nuclear device, that might be the end to world? Gaboom. Quite a mix! ;D
Yikes! ;D
Carry on your "debate". I've got better things to do.
Does anyone know the Gates hose part #?
Any tips on how to prevent water from leaking into the space the hose passes thru?
Quote from: 2112 on September 09, 2020, 10:22:02 AM
Does anyone know the Gates hose part #?
Any tips on how to prevent water from leaking into the space the hose passes thru?
And comedians need not respond. ;D
One link, there are others
Gates® 23848 more details on - https://www.carid.com/gates/engine-defroster-air-intake-hose-mpn-23848.html
Quote from: JD on September 09, 2020, 11:49:05 AM
One link, there are others
Gates® 23848 more details on - https://www.carid.com/gates/engine-defroster-air-intake-hose-mpn-23848.html
That is a good alternate that is more weather proof but does not have the appearance of the original. With that said it is after all concealed.
I bought a Gates 23848 hose a few years ago and it no longer had the metal ribbing but was a plastic ribbing. May be able to find older stock with original metal ribs but should ask first if that is what you want. The photo posted may be older design.
Kurt
^^^ Kurt, thanks
Yes, the one site had images that did look like metal but others had the plastic and looks very different.
I found one on Ebay. The seller says it has metal ribbing.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/GATES-DEFROSTER-HOSE-AIR-INTAKE-HOSE-23848-3-DIAMTER/273228651820?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649
Looks close but not exact - take a look and see if it will work for you.
Kurt.
Try OPGI and see if their hoses might work, they offer various diameters and lengths.
https://www.opgi.com/fittings-hoses/hoses/heaterac-side-duct-hose/duct-hose-1954-88-gm-vehicles-heater-ac-3-vinyl-c210191.html
Quote from: CSX 4133 on September 11, 2020, 11:17:23 AM
Try OPGI and see if their hoses might work, they offer various diameters and lengths.
https://www.opgi.com/fittings-hoses/hoses/heaterac-side-duct-hose/duct-hose-1954-88-gm-vehicles-heater-ac-3-vinyl-c210191.html
Will most likely work but doesn't look the same as what was used back in the day if you are trying for the look along with function. Picture in reply #13 is what it typically looked like . There were some other variations.
Branda's version
http://store.cobranda.com/19shbrdukit.html
Quote from: Bob Gaines on September 11, 2020, 11:25:59 AM
Quote from: CSX 4133 on September 11, 2020, 11:17:23 AM
Try OPGI and see if their hoses might work, they offer various diameters and lengths.
https://www.opgi.com/fittings-hoses/hoses/heaterac-side-duct-hose/duct-hose-1954-88-gm-vehicles-heater-ac-3-vinyl-c210191.html
Will most likely work but doesn't look the same as what was used back in the day if you are trying for the look along with function. Picture in reply #13 is what it typically looked like . There were some other variations.
I was afraid of that :-\.... has anyone tried Dead Nuts On and see if they have a source.
Quote from: Bossbill on September 08, 2020, 06:52:55 PM
Mustang Defrost duct? That's 2 1/2" ID.
The brake cooling hose inlet is 3" OD.
Does it look like any of these?
Bill, did you end up getting any of these aircraft hoses?
I bought some of the gates hose.......meh. Maybe looks similar to the original but looks like a water trap to me.
http://www.colemanracing.com/BRAKE-DUCT-HOSE-P4350.aspx
Not sure how close this is.
Quote from: davez on September 24, 2020, 10:51:32 AM
http://www.colemanracing.com/BRAKE-DUCT-HOSE-P4350.aspx
Not sure how close this is.
Looks closer to me.
Do the wheel well adapters get installed from the outside or the inside? It looks like they were originally done from the outside and it would be easier to pop-rivet them on that way?
Quote from: shelbydoug on September 25, 2020, 07:34:53 AM
Do the wheel well adapters get installed from the outside or the inside? It looks like they were originally done from the outside and it would be easier to pop-rivet them on that way?
From the inside after the seat and trim panels were removed.
To do from the outside they would have to remove the undercoating sound deadner sprayed on the wheelhouse to get a tight fit.
Quote from: davez on September 25, 2020, 08:04:05 AM
Quote from: shelbydoug on September 25, 2020, 07:34:53 AM
Do the wheel well adapters get installed from the outside or the inside? It looks like they were originally done from the outside and it would be easier to pop-rivet them on that way?
From the inside after the seat and trim panels were removed.
To do from the outside they would have to remove the undercoating sound deadner sprayed on the wheelhouse to get a tight fit.
So it's "correct" to have the pop-rivets sticking through into the wheel well?
Quote from: shelbydoug on September 25, 2020, 08:19:58 AM
Quote from: davez on September 25, 2020, 08:04:05 AM
Quote from: shelbydoug on September 25, 2020, 07:34:53 AM
Do the wheel well adapters get installed from the outside or the inside? It looks like they were originally done from the outside and it would be easier to pop-rivet them on that way?
From the inside after the seat and trim panels were removed.
To do from the outside they would have to remove the undercoating sound deadner sprayed on the wheelhouse to get a tight fit.
So it's "correct" to have the pop-rivets sticking through into the wheel well?
Yes, they really don't show much, red arrows, the black are the rivets connecting the hose to the adapter and you can see the rust on the metal flat-rib embedded in the duct material.
And a look inside the car...
Quote from: shelbydoug on September 25, 2020, 07:34:53 AM
Do the wheel well adapters get installed from the outside or the inside? It looks like they were originally done from the outside and it would be easier to pop-rivet them on that way?
The inside of the car wheel well surface was a more consistent smoother surface for the tube adapters to seal to compared to the undercoat/sound deadener side. The undercoat/sound deadener side didn't need to be cleared away for the pop rivets to secure.
Did the adapter get "caulked" to the inner wheel well with butyl or similar?
Quote from: 2112 on September 25, 2020, 10:51:33 AM
Did the adapter get "caulked" to the inner wheel well with butyl or similar?
I have found strip caulk some refer to as dum dum..
Quote from: Bob Gaines on September 25, 2020, 11:33:53 AM
Quote from: 2112 on September 25, 2020, 10:51:33 AM
Did the adapter get "caulked" to the inner wheel well with butyl or similar?
I have found strip caulk some refer to as dum dum..
Oil based strip caulking is obsolete. You need to buy it from a scalper if you can find any that is not dried out and like a rock.
Quote from: shelbydoug on September 25, 2020, 01:34:18 PM
Quote from: Bob Gaines on September 25, 2020, 11:33:53 AM
Quote from: 2112 on September 25, 2020, 10:51:33 AM
Did the adapter get "caulked" to the inner wheel well with butyl or similar?
I have found strip caulk some refer to as dum dum..
Oil based strip caulking is obsolete. You need to buy it from a scalper if you can find any that is not dried out and like a rock.
3M sells a acceptable strip caulk .NPD,Eastwood and others.
https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/pnpages/05-30512-6.php?msclkid=2b6797c09ca11b919925c8ae023d87f8&utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=TNT%20-%20Shopping%20-%20NB%20-%20Tablet&utm_term=4580359283446172&utm_content=All%20Products
Looks like it will trap less water.
How long is each piece?