SAAC Forum

Deals and Appeals => Up For Auction => Topic started by: 67_1183 on December 08, 2021, 07:12:48 PM

Title: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: 67_1183 on December 08, 2021, 07:12:48 PM

https://www.hemmings.com/classifieds/cars-for-sale/shelby/gt500/2533998.html

Seller’s Description:
- Shelby no. 341
- One family owned until 2006
- 27,435 miles since new
- According to the original owner's son, the 427 CI engine side oiler engine and custom dash plaque were installed by Shelby American for his father
- Driven by the original owner, J.T. Cosby, at Green Valley Speedway to a top speed of 203.1 MPH on January 21, 1969
- Mostly unrestored with one repaint
- Original Black interior
- Original Shelby 10-spoke wheels
- Sidewinder aluminum intake manifold
- Inboard driving lights
- C6 automatic transmission
- 2,400 stall converter
- Power steering
- Under-dash Stewart Warner gauges
- Sold new at Horn Williams Ford in Dallas, Texas

To be sold at the Kissimmee 2022 auction, Kissimmee, FL, January 6-16, 2022. To consign a car or to register to bid, visit the Mecum web site: www.mecum.com or call (262) 275-5050


(https://image.hmn.com/TlMn5AeQI_P5cqu9jwXr15Q25oQ=/900x0/uimage/83615226.jpg)

Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: Bob Gaines on December 08, 2021, 08:13:26 PM
Some pretty strong claims about the cars history.   ::)  . I guess we are expected to take his word without question. :o
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: shelbydoug on December 08, 2021, 08:46:06 PM
Maybe he means that they put it in an airplane and the plane flew at 203mph?
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: deathsled on December 08, 2021, 08:48:12 PM
Maybe he means that they put it in an airplane and the plane flew at 203mph?
Ding ding
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: Bill on December 08, 2021, 08:49:42 PM
Didn't we go through this with a 69 Mach I in Catskills a few years ago  ::)

Something about a brick and it's aerodynamics.


Bill
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: 98SVT - was 06GT on December 08, 2021, 08:56:07 PM
I'll come right out and say it - BS. https://www.motortrend.com/features/the-truth-about-200-mph/

At Bville we busted out butts with a Boss 302 in a 1969 Mach1 and could only get it to 170. The same car with a 500+ HP FE ran 185ish.

My 70 with a very good 351C would top out just a hint above 160

My GT1 car with more aero and over 600hp will hit 170 on the front straight of Willow Springs.

I've got a friend in the 2 club at Bville he ran 241+ in 1986 and bumped the class record about 3 mph Model A roadster. They guessed they were making almost 800 hp.
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: Wedgeman on December 08, 2021, 09:24:01 PM
Could that be the 1  of  NONE....." STUPID SNAKE "..?.. :o
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: 6s1802 on December 08, 2021, 09:36:45 PM
201 MPH, what cliff did they throw it off?
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: 557 on December 08, 2021, 10:15:57 PM
Wow,yet another Shelby American installed 427 car….Kinda common these days…A little surprised my car didn’t get that “factory upgrade”.. :o
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: GT350DAVE on December 08, 2021, 11:05:34 PM
I know the front of the car didn't look like that. My car at 128mph goes through a transformation when the air gets under it because of lack of downforce. It definitely makes you pucker up. A front air dam is definitely necessary after 140.
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: Side-Oilers on December 08, 2021, 11:52:44 PM
Maybe he's dyslexic and it's really 123.0 mph.   
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: Don Johnston on December 09, 2021, 12:14:08 AM
Kilometer speedo?
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: 430dragpack on December 09, 2021, 08:59:24 AM
Has anyone seen another SAI dash plaque, like that one before or know what vintage it might be? 
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: JD on December 09, 2021, 11:53:20 AM
Has anyone seen another SAI dash plaque, like this one before or know what vintage it might be? 

You mean this one?

Yes, I think dealers were able to get them from Shelby and engrave them for customers, although this one appears to have an additional engraved plate added.  Thought someone was making repro's

Here is an image and link:
https://store.cobranda.com/cashpl.html
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: PrettyMuchAShelbyGuy on December 09, 2021, 02:43:42 PM
Yea... I'll call BS too.  I raced @ Green Valley back in the day.  Road Course or 1/4 mile, no way to go 200+ there safely.  Absolutely zero.  Anyone remember the run-off area?  You hit that and it was not going to be good.  I'll see if I can find anything, but I recall more than 1 person who had to use it died.  One of the reasons for the move to Texas Motorplex in Ennis was the run off area...  Hell, I doubt Bobby's Super Snake would have gotten to 175 @ GV.
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: 98SVT - was 06GT on December 09, 2021, 04:56:56 PM
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aston_Martin_Bulldog

The Aston Martin Bulldog from 1980 has been rebuilt and will try for 200 again. It made 181 back in the day and so far hit 162 in a shakedown run last month.
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: FL SAAC on December 09, 2021, 05:08:06 PM
Amazing
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: tesgt350 on December 10, 2021, 08:17:55 AM
Just curious, I have read a few articles in the past where Altitude was discussed that, when it comes to Drag Racing and Speed, Altitude makes all the difference.  Using the same Car, leaving all the adjustments the same, which Track would get the Fastest MPH and which Track would get the slowest MPH?
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: shelbydoug on December 10, 2021, 08:46:13 AM
If you put it in a military cargo plane, it will do about 600mph at 35,000 feet?

Is that what you want to know?




You might want to ask Randy that question about "good air/bad air" speed differences. I want to say that the difference is about 2mph in top speed through the traps in something like a Pro Stock.
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: 68stangcjfb on December 10, 2021, 11:11:32 AM
A 2.65 rear gear ratio with a 26 inch tall tire and 7000 rpm will get you to 204 mph. But that doesn't figure in torque converter slippage and the fact that that front end is
basically a barn door at that speed. I imagine it would take way more horsepower than that 427 could ever make in 1969. Maybe it was a 427 SOHC with a supercharger?😁
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: 98SVT - was 06GT on December 10, 2021, 12:41:13 PM
Just curious, I have read a few articles in the past where Altitude was discussed that, when it comes to Drag Racing and Speed, Altitude makes all the difference.  Using the same Car, leaving all the adjustments the same, which Track would get the Fastest MPH and which Track would get the slowest MPH?

Thinner air at higher altitude is easier to go through - but HP in a NA engine is harder to make. Superchargers can help make up for the thin air by increasing the speed to cram more air in.

Sea level air will make more power and far out weigh the aero advantage of thin air at altitude.

You can't leave the adjustments the same. A car tuned for sea level would be far too rich at altitude. This is where newer engine controls have a big advantage. They are able to reduce fuel and increase timing to get back some of the HP loss as the altitude increases.

Holley recommends 1 jet size per 1000 ft. elevation change. More altitude = less jet.

Also, 1 jet size change per 35 degrees F difference of inlet air temp. Hotter = less jet.
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: shelbydoug on December 10, 2021, 12:58:12 PM
I'm not even sure how the SS made 170 something?

The steering on the car gets light depending on cross winds in the 125 to 135 mph vicinity.

I hit 155 briefly at Utica and the nose started to buck. The hood scoop was whistling to the extent that people needed to come up to me and tell me, "your car is whistling!".  ::)

I saw Perogie at Pocono in what appeared to be an attempt to make the 427 blow up coming down the straight. Exactly what speed that was, no one had a speed gun on him.

I had Webers on my car which I'm sure that was part of the whistling thing since I was running closed headers. So the exhaust noise didn't drown that out.


Interesting experiences but I'm very sure that any "Mustang" needs some very serious aerodynamic intervention to even consider being able to approach 200?

I was taking a ride in CSX3036 at Pocono. Hiding down under the windshield so the wind wouldn't catch my open helmet and jerk my head back. The speedo was right in front of me, reading 176 or so, the tach was at 8,200 in 4th and the fuel pressure gauge was pulsing back and forth from zero to 7 like a Grandfather clock, and Dick Smith came flying by us in the turn.

That car, CSX3035 was said to have been timed at 195mph. So 203 in even a '67 GT500 is highly likely to be a Bass Ale induced imagination?


You know, 176 is ok if you are driving. As a passenger in a 2500 land cruise missle with a guy with ZERO high speed experience and going through his second divorce, it can make you think?  ::)
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: 98SVT - was 06GT on December 10, 2021, 04:40:26 PM
You know, 176 is ok if you are driving. As a passenger in a 2500 land cruise missle with a guy with ZERO high speed experience and going through his second divorce, it can make you think?  ::)

I did the same thing with Sam Johnson in 3014 at Willow Springs. I think the full windshield is what held us to 160. After I got out it hit me what was I thinking? Not even a roll bar on my side. If I remember it was Sam Johnson's parents company that made the original tape side letters for the 65 GT350s. He had the original tooling and made a run of new ones around 75-78. I still have a pair.
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: shelbydoug on December 10, 2021, 05:20:05 PM
You know, 176 is ok if you are driving. As a passenger in a 2500 land cruise missle with a guy with ZERO high speed experience and going through his second divorce, it can make you think?  ::)

I did the same thing with Sam Johnson in 3014 at Willow Springs. I think the full windshield is what held us to 160. After I got out it hit me what was I thinking? Not even a roll bar on my side. If I remember it was Sam Johnson's parents company that made the original tape side letters for the 65 GT350s. He had the original tooling and made a run of new ones around 75-78. I still have a pair.

Well you wear the seat belts so the cleanup crew can find the body...maybe.

After that I'm more respectful of passengers and I try to be smooth.



I do remember being buzzed getting out and it took a minute to get enough feelings back in my feet and legs.

There is just something about a big block Cobra at speed. I didn't know which part of that to be more concerned about? The rpm or the mph?



After the convention, he went to start the car. It was shaking and sounded like there was a bolt swirling around in the bell house. The engine was gone. Aluminum block too.

He was told not to go over 7000 with it. I saw the tach. It was between 8400 and 8200 rpm.

"I don't understand that" was the quote that I heard. "My engine was built by Smiths 'guy so I tried to keep up with him!"

YIKES! I don't know if I was buzzing from the car or the driver? Amazing.


I'm not complaining, just remarking but I should have know better to let my son drive home from VIR in our mini-van rental. 9 hours of the monkey driving the Dragon Coaster at 95mph in bumper to bumper.

95 is as fast as they go you know? The boy ain't smooth. That thing shook just like the Dragon Coaster. Even the girl in the BMW couldn't keep up and gave us the "finger" all the way up to the elbow! ::)
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: 98SVT - was 06GT on December 11, 2021, 12:02:10 AM
I'm not complaining, just remarking but I should have know better to let my son drive home from VIR in our mini-van rental. 9 hours of the monkey driving the Dragon Coaster at 95mph in bumper to bumper.

95 is as fast as they go you know? The boy ain't smooth. That thing shook just like the Dragon Coaster. Even the girl in the BMW couldn't keep up and gave us the "finger" all the way up to the elbow! ::)

We were at Bonneville and Dean Moon's daughter had to get back to the airport in a hurry. She had a rental Pinto and we tried drafting it behind a Boss 302. It kept falling out of the draft about 110-5. We stuffed a screwdriver through the fuel filter and it would then keep up to about 125. She got there with 20 minutes to spare.
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: S7MS427 on December 11, 2021, 01:32:03 PM
I saw Perogie at Pocono in what appeared to be an attempt to make the 427 blow up coming down the straight. Exactly what speed that was, no one had a speed gun on him.

That's just the way Big George drives.  I think when I asked him what the speedo was reading during that pass he said it was 140 or so.  No way to verify that.  But there he was, blasting down the straight, pedal to the metal, nose lifted high, and his arm hanging out the window without a care in the world.  But I agree, hitting 200 is pretty damn near impossible.

That was the same year I drove my '85 Mustang GT 80 laps in the track.  I enjoyed every one of them.  Never did get above 120 at the end of the straight.
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: jk66gt350 on December 11, 2021, 02:39:37 PM
After I bought 6S1575 in 1986, I tracked down the 1st two owners.  One of the neat discussions I had with the original owner was about the legend that was still taped to the front of the dash pad - see attached picture.  He lived in Springfield Missouri and his girlfriend lived in Dallas.  He said he was working as a mechanic in the late 60's and sometimes before going to see his girlfriend for the weekend, he would swap out the stock rear end gears for 2.73's I believe.  He claimed that allowed him to get over 140 mph out of the car.  The engine was stock other than a lemans cam and 2 x 4bbl holleys - the same as it still is.  I have no way of verifying what actual speed he was actually able to get with that setup, but it made for a good story - one of many that he shared with me about the fun he had with the car in the day.   
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: Bob Gaines on December 11, 2021, 02:56:38 PM
Dash pad notes most likey are numbers that were theoretical in this case but it looks very impressive if taken in the context of speed achieved.
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: FL SAAC on December 11, 2021, 03:11:17 PM
Amazing !

I checked the "Guinness World Records" and it is true.  Vehicle was dropped from a B52 bomber from 28,000 feet and reached precisely 203.1 MPH

The results where not good once it hit land.

Attached are pictures of car in flight and once it landed.....
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: 557 on December 11, 2021, 04:42:09 PM
That’s one tasty looking car! ;D
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: J_Speegle on December 11, 2021, 05:37:33 PM
We were at Bonneville and Dean Moon's daughter had to get back to the airport in a hurry. She had a rental Pinto and we tried drafting it behind a Boss 302. It kept falling out of the draft about 110-5. We stuffed a screwdriver through the fuel filter and it would then keep up to about 125. She got there with 20 minutes to spare.

Can you explain this?
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: davez on December 11, 2021, 05:45:29 PM
I'm guessing he means he punched a hole through the Internal screen essentially hollowing it out. Not through the outer case
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: 98SVT - was 06GT on December 11, 2021, 07:56:06 PM
I'm guessing he means he punched a hole through the Internal screen essentially hollowing it out. Not through the outer case
yes
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: J_Speegle on December 11, 2021, 09:10:09 PM
Thanks
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: FL SAAC on December 11, 2021, 09:34:52 PM
We would like to take a stab at this:

We believe it means that a sharp object such as a rod, a screwdriver or a power drill with a diamond bit was insert through the casing of this distillate fuel filter. Rendering it's internal filtering elements completely useless. But increasing its flow ten fold, thus producing additional horsepower enabling such vehicle to reach it's  potential speed of 203.1 MPH.

Science  !

Oh and be sure to wear personal protective  equipment
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: shelbydoug on December 12, 2021, 08:02:31 AM
We would like to take a stab at this:

We believe it means that a sharp object such as a rod, a screwdriver or a power drill with a diamond bit was insert through the casing of this distillate fuel filter. Rendering it's internal filtering elements completely useless. But increasing its flow ten fold, thus producing additional horsepower enabling such vehicle to reach it's  potential speed of 203.1 MPH.

Science  !

Oh and be sure to wear personal protective  equipment

It comes from reading what a pre-frontal lobotomy is. A little knowledge can be dangerous...or not.
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: 427heaven on December 12, 2021, 09:21:54 AM
^^^^^^^ Looks like that family is preparing to stand in front of Frank Mecum, at a Mecum auction! ;D
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: oldcanuck on December 14, 2021, 04:55:36 PM
Looks like that family is preparing to stand in front of Frank Mecum, at a Mecum auction! ;D

I wonder if Frank got the reserve lifted on the teddy bear ?
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: 427heaven on December 14, 2021, 05:40:23 PM
They were preparing for a bid with a FOUR or FIVE in it... Thats when the particulates fly!
Title: Re: 1967 GT500 #341, a 203.1 MPH car?
Post by: BGlover67 on December 27, 2021, 11:28:12 AM
We would like to take a stab at this:

We believe it means that a sharp object such as a rod, a screwdriver or a power drill with a diamond bit was insert through the casing of this distillate fuel filter. Rendering it's internal filtering elements completely useless. But increasing its flow ten fold, thus producing additional horsepower enabling such vehicle to reach it's  potential speed of 203.1 MPH.

Science  !

Oh and be sure to wear personal protective  equipment

John Travolta had it right all those years ago.