Does anyone happen to know how many 1968 GT350's are still on the road. I read where 1053 were produced (including Hertz cars).
Or even how many registered with SAAC ?
Thanks
The '68 registrar may have a rough idea, but based only on information provided by owners and such. The SAAC registry will indicate the last owner update and condition of the car. If it hasn't been done before and someone has some spare time, it could be mapped in a spreadsheet.
The psychology of this question has always interested me. Presumably it implies rarity is being sought. The number you cited is such a small drop in the bucket they are are already extremely rare. Hundreds of thousands of Mustangs were built at the same time. Curious why you ask?
First the assumption is being made that the Shelby club knows about all the cars
They do not
If you own a car you are under no obligation to tell anyone. There are many cars still around the club does not know anything about
The club probably has information on more than 80% of the cars built based on their publications
A Registry would be a good purchase for you
That's a tough question to answer even for someone like a SAAC Registrar.
First, it relies on someone to report a car to the Registry. There is this odd phenominon out there that some don't want ANYONE else to know their business on ANYTHING.
Part of that is "WTF is SAAC and why should I tell them?".
Then SAAC has been doing registries since it's inception in 1975 and was looking for information that even then was old to try to fill in the blanks. Some of that information as far as LKO is still the "latest" information on a car.
Then amongst that, the SAAC Registrar hasn't seen the vast majority of the cars they have information on. It could be paper information that was reported to them nearly 50 years ago and that's all that was left of it then?
So, probably the Registrar can report how many cars they have information on, how many they don't and how many have been reported destroyed?
Actually knowing how many still exist, still, is just an educated guess or maybe a better term is speculation?
Thanks for the input. Curiosity i guess. I always see the GT500's up for sale and rarely see the GT350's.
Funny I bought the GT350 because of the smaller engine having owned some 428 CJ's previously and what a monster
they were.
I am asking as an owner of one and curious what the survival rate has been. I would think not even 30% of the 1000 plus might still be around.
I know as a teenager I racked up a few sports cars and figured why would that not be the case with these. Granted a 350 is not quite the 428 but it is all relative to a 16 yr old.
Great point made that SAAC probably has a number of registered cars that no longer exist given the time span they cover.
I collect a bunch of different makes and models and just simply one day came across the SAAC organization and registered my car.
I do believe there are quite a few owners who don't even know SAAC exists or wants to keep their ownership private.
My spouse thinks i need to sell my GT350 as I never drive it. I never drive it as I live in a big city with crazy drivers. I've managed to hang onto it since 2004 but who knows. Hoping the best for 2022 and Blessings to all.
Welcome aboard Copescobra
I can assure you the number exceeds 75% accounted for, probably higher.
Quote from: Coralsnake on January 08, 2022, 10:08:01 PM
I can assure you the number exceeds 75% accounted for, probably higher.
Well if you consider that Marti has access to the official Ford records, then the number "accounted" for is likely close to 100% if not 100%. That doesn't indicate the survival rate though.
Who knows where they all have scattered to? There still are places on the Earth that have roads but no electricity.
I prefer to think of all of these cars like the story of the "Yellow Rolls Royce" where you just can't kill them but know one knows for sure where they are.
I would assume the attrition rate is pretty low considering that they were fairly bullet proof cars which arent known for being extensively raced. However many no longer walk the earth were likely killed off due to accidents/scrpping back when they were "just cars"...but I would assume the number of cars which would have been that severely wrecked would be fairly low. Id bet 75%+ like Pete said above...probably more likely 90%. Just a guess of course.
Kind regards,
Vern
Quote from: Vernon Estes on January 09, 2022, 09:55:06 AM
I would assume the attrition rate is pretty low considering that they were fairly bullet proof cars which arent known for being extensively raced. However many no longer walk the earth were likely killed off due to accidents/scrpping back when they were "just cars"...but I would assume the number of cars which would have been that severely wrecked would be fairly low. Id bet 75%+ like Pete said above...probably more likely 90%. Just a guess of course.
Kind regards,
Vern
Anyone's guess is as good as anyone else's but I'd phrase it this way, their presence at SAAC events over the last 46 years has been remarkably low.
Seemingly a key factor in a discussion I remember from more years ago then I care to admit to is that something on the order of 80% seemed to apparently survived across all years with '67s having the highest mortality rate.
Well, my guess is definitely better than yours.
I have pictures of over 30% of the 1968s. By no means do I have anything close to all there are to be found.
For every file I have, I guarantee you there is another one I dont have.
Quote from: Coralsnake on January 09, 2022, 12:56:27 PM
Well, my guess is definitely better than yours.
I have pictures of over 30% of the 1968s. By no means do I have anything close to all there are to be found.
For every file I have, I guarantee you there is another one I dont have.
Of course your guess is better then mine. Better then everyones. YOU are the Coralsnake. Only surpassed by Karnack the Magnificent. 8)
A guaranty is just a paragraph in a proposal that states what one party will do for the other party in the event of something specific happening.
What are you proposing that your guaranty encompass? Inquiring minds need to know? :D
Love you Doug
Quote from: Coralsnake on January 09, 2022, 01:43:15 PM
Love you Doug
I would not accept that as a guaranty settlement.
I'll have to go with what Coralsnake has posted.
well attended the Carrol Shelby event at the Peterson Museum and there was 1 other 68 GT350 there. So I at least know of 1 other.
Funny that a guy with a 66 GT350 had not even thought of registering his with SAAC until coming out to the event.
Maybe 6 total Shelby cars from 66-69 and a nice selection of 5 Cobra's. Of course the newer 2007 up models ruled the day with maybe 100+ there
I seem to be addicted to BAT and always notice the 500's or 1966's.
Did notice a few 68 GT350's at Mecum last week.
Another way to look at this is consider that of the 1053 68 GT350 fastbacks built, that would have only been 21 per state in the US, if divided equally (we know that's not the actual case). Not sure how many were exported, but it's a pretty low number looking at it that way.
The survival rate was probably higher than a typical Mustang from the same time. Mostly due to Shelby's being higher priced and maybe most not being used as daily drivers, but instead pleasure use cars.
I predict charles 68 gt 350 vert will set a new record as i seen it painted at browns shop and assembled at billups shop later when finished assembled with charles helping final assembly. One of my first shelbys in early 80s was a 68 gt350 4 speed dark moss green that i used \\to take deer hunting )till a pick up trunk ran into me) was the only muscle car that could get rubber in 4 th gear not on rocks haha
Where/when is that car ( Charles) being sold?
friday evening.
Quote from: Rukiddin on January 22, 2022, 08:03:35 AM
Where/when is that car ( Charles) being sold?
See up for auction subforum for all auction details ;)
I'll have to report back having just received my 2020 1968 Register.
At first glance there seem to be a lot of "missing" or not current going back decades.
It will be a while before I can report back - for anyone interested.......
Barrett Jackson was a frenzy IMO-
Seemed like red ruled the day.
Quote from: Copescobra on February 11, 2022, 02:12:09 AM
Barrett Jackson was a frenzy IMO-
Seemed like red ruled the day.
I think the high sale '68 was the red KR fastback... 2nd highest sales was a tie of 2 highland green cars, a KR fastback and my car... followed by a ton or red ones!
Quote from: shelbydoug on January 06, 2022, 08:02:38 AM
So, probably the Registrar can report how many cars they have information on, how many they don't and how many have been reported destroyed?
and reborn. With current prices I'm certain that many owners who lost these cars to accidents and/or rust many years ago are taking that tag out of the toolbox or off the garage wall and thinking of how to cash in.
My brother and both own 1968 GT 350's since the late 1970's. They haven't seen the light of day since the mid 1980's. Some day I will get mine back on the road. My brother on the other hand won't. It will be a future barn find. Both our cars are not in the registry.
Agree with Vernon. These were special cars when new, and while prices were soft on the GT500's in the late 1970's when gas prices went crazy the GT350's were thought to be more valuable, and hence were not scrapped as often, even if they were in what seemed to be pretty bad shape.
No one has ever thought of a Shelby from this period of time as anything other than special. So, most of them still survive. Exact number, no one will ever know. But definitely in the 75 - 85% range.
Quote from: Vernon Estes on January 09, 2022, 09:55:06 AM
I would assume the attrition rate is pretty low considering that they were fairly bullet proof cars which arent known for being extensively raced. However many no longer walk the earth were likely killed off due to accidents/scrpping back when they were "just cars"...but I would assume the number of cars which would have been that severely wrecked would be fairly low. Id bet 75%+ like Pete said above...probably more likely 90%. Just a guess of course.
Kind regards,
Vern
Quote from: Vernon Estes on January 09, 2022, 09:55:06 AM
I would assume the attrition rate is pretty low considering that they were fairly bullet proof cars which arent known for being extensively raced. However many no longer walk the earth were likely killed off due to accidents/scrpping back when they were "just cars"...but I would assume the number of cars which would have been that severely wrecked would be fairly low. Id bet 75%+ like Pete said above...probably more likely 90%. Just a guess of course.
Kind regards,
Vern
+ 1
I never did and still do not understand the reluctance of being listed or identified in the SAAC Registries.
Apparently it varies according to the year and model but for some reason 68 GT350's seem to hold a special revanence, i.e., a special secret appreciation for that?
Quote from: Rbuddy98 on February 11, 2022, 06:03:47 PM
My brother and both own 1968 GT 350's since the late 1970's. They haven't seen the light of day since the mid 1980's. Some day I will get mine back on the road. My brother on the other hand won't. It will be a future barn find. Both our cars are not in the registry.
Contrary to popular believe, while your name may not be publically in the registry, it may be known to the registrar. In addition, your car, while not listed under your name within the registry, it is still listed there.
Just saying 8)
Bill
Quote from: shelbydoug on February 13, 2022, 08:43:09 AM
I never did and still do not understand the reluctance of being listed or identified in the SAAC Registries.
Apparently it varies according to the year and model but for some reason 68 GT350's seem to hold a special revanence, i.e., a special secret appreciation for that?
Here is one reason. My car was in the 87 registry(all others since) and a guy comes knocking on my door in the early 90s at night. It was one of the Rick brothers from Rick Ford here in Mi. Seems he ran my VIN through the SOS and got my name and address. Did I get mad? No. I showed him the car and he gave me his info. It seems he ran a LOT of Shelbys through the SOS here in Mi to get their locations. That would be a great reason why someone would not want to be in a registry. Now about that FBI agent that came knocking on my door back around 1988 that is another car story.....
Quote from: shelbymann1970 on February 13, 2022, 09:29:20 AM
Quote from: shelbydoug on February 13, 2022, 08:43:09 AM
I never did and still do not understand the reluctance of being listed or identified in the SAAC Registries.
Apparently it varies according to the year and model but for some reason 68 GT350's seem to hold a special revanence, i.e., a special secret appreciation for that?
Here is one reason. My car was in the 87 registry(all others since) and a guy comes knocking on my door in the early 90s at night. It was one of the Rick brothers from Rick Ford here in Mi. Seems he ran my VIN through the SOS and got my name and address. Did I get mad? No. I showed him the car and he gave me his info. It seems he ran a LOT of Shelbys through the SOS here in Mi to get their locations. That would be a great reason why someone would not want to be in a registry. Now about that FBI agent that came knocking on my door back around 1988 that is another car story.....
During the pre-publication days of the '82 Registry, Howard Pardee had already gone the route of the DMV's.
I don't know if Howard was responsible but shortly after/during it, California passed an anti-stalking bill where DMV records were no longer Public information.
There was some rhetoric and "discussion" but in California's case, it is probably more about "celebrates" complaining about exposed privacy.
An added note, we are so used to having data at our fingertips now via the Internet, that it is difficult to believe that only maybe 1/2 the states DMV records at the time were on any kind of an "internet computer system". Meaning even if you could still access information in a state like New Hampshire, you couldn't get a print out because the state system didn't have the capability.
OK. You are missing the point here I suspect? Why is it that just '68 GT350 owners are afraid? Get it yet?
Also, considering that there may be blank spaces in any year of the "Registry", it's more likely that there is either no FORD information available about those cars or the particular Shelby Registrar, just hasn't received it as yet?
It does seem that Marti has it.
"As it was in the beginning, so it shall be for always". "WTF is the SAAC Registry and WTF should they be entitled to the information?" That's the feedback that I get often with quite hostile tones. ;) This is an old battle and frankly I was done with it 20 years ago. It's not going to change anytime soon.
"The Registry" was/is done in good faith and there will ALWAYS be anti-vac'ers out there with their own "special" reasons for not participating. Maybe they see it as another fascist deal and they like 'Hells Angels' are the only truely free Americans left? Who cares at this point?
Quote from: shelbydoug on February 13, 2022, 09:56:18 AM
Quote from: shelbymann1970 on February 13, 2022, 09:29:20 AM
Quote from: shelbydoug on February 13, 2022, 08:43:09 AM
I never did and still do not understand the reluctance of being listed or identified in the SAAC Registries.
Apparently it varies according to the year and model but for some reason 68 GT350's seem to hold a special revanence, i.e., a special secret appreciation for that?
Here is one reason. My car was in the 87 registry(all others since) and a guy comes knocking on my door in the early 90s at night. It was one of the Rick brothers from Rick Ford here in Mi. Seems he ran my VIN through the SOS and got my name and address. Did I get mad? No. I showed him the car and he gave me his info. It seems he ran a LOT of Shelbys through the SOS here in Mi to get their locations. That would be a great reason why someone would not want to be in a registry. Now about that FBI agent that came knocking on my door back around 1988 that is another car story.....
During the pre-publication days of the '82 Registry, Howard Pardee had already gone the route of the DMV's.
I don't know if Howard was responsible but shortly after/during it, California passed an anti-stalking bill where DMV records were no longer Public information.
There was some rhetoric and "discussion" but in California's case, it is probably more about "celebrates" complaining about exposed privacy.
An added note, we are so used to having data at our fingertips now via the Internet, that it is difficult to believe that only maybe 1/2 the states DMV records at the time were on any kind of an "internet computer system". Meaning even if you could still access information in a state like New Hampshire, you couldn't get a print out because the state system didn't have the capability.
OK. You are missing the point here I suspect? Why is it that just '68 GT350 owners are afraid? Get it yet?
I'm not missing any point here. Only stating that there are those who didn't want someone come knocking on their door asking if they owned their car. Here in Michigan if a car isn't registered for 5 years it is purged out of the system so longtime owners with unregistered cars Howard never would have found here doing a search. Can't tell you about other states. I'm a "pro Register your car" person.
I remember when my neighbor went around 1993 to get his 63 HiPo Fairlane plated at our Sec of State. They had no record of it. They asked when he last plated the car. 1963 he said(still had the 63 plate on it as he towed it to the track racing it over the years until he had to quit racing in the early 70s). I also tried to do a search of my 69 Boss 429 in 1986. Since the previous 2 owners never licensed it and the current owner had it longer than 5 years the title search history was non existent. BTW why would you think it is just 68 owners? There are those I know who don't use credit cards and pay cash for everything whenever possible. They are amongst us and some possibly own Shelbys, Vettes, etc across the marques.
Every state has different information policies.
I've owned my 68 since 1972. I am in New York. No one bothers me. Maybe they heard that I bite?
Maybe insurance companies have more up-to-date info. Even project cars are being insured to some extent. Not that they would share that info readily,but the info is there. After 50 + years of abuse,rust,fires,floods,tornadoes,hurricanes,collisions,thefts,etc many are "gone"/eliminated. From about 1981-1992 our cars were not "treasured". It did not take much damage to "total" one out. Once they hit the junk yards they were quickly parted out,the hulk got sold by the pound.
Since we are all just giving opinions on this subject,mine is that approx 60% remain in existance. Of that number many will never see the road again. JMO
Owners name and state can be withheld on request with no issues. What's the excuse for that?
I can understand withholding personal information to keep away from the divorce attorney. 8)
Quote from: shelbymann1970 on February 13, 2022, 09:29:20 AM
Here is one reason. My car was in the 87 registry(all others since) and a guy comes knocking on my door in the early 90s at night. It was one of the Rick brothers from Rick Ford here in Mi. Seems he ran my VIN through the SOS and got my name and address. Did I get mad? No. I showed him the car and he gave me his info. It seems he ran a LOT of Shelbys through the SOS here in Mi to get their locations. That would be a great reason why someone would not want to be in a registry. Now about that FBI agent that came knocking on my door back around 1988 that is another car story.....
Most states only need the VIN to do a search, name is not needed. There has always been an option to withhold ones name from the printed registry, afaik. I also do not really get the reluctance to offer info on the car while still being able to be anonymous from the printed version.
Quote from: CharlesTurner on February 13, 2022, 11:52:52 AM
Quote from: shelbymann1970 on February 13, 2022, 09:29:20 AM
Here is one reason. My car was in the 87 registry(all others since) and a guy comes knocking on my door in the early 90s at night. It was one of the Rick brothers from Rick Ford here in Mi. Seems he ran my VIN through the SOS and got my name and address. Did I get mad? No. I showed him the car and he gave me his info. It seems he ran a LOT of Shelbys through the SOS here in Mi to get their locations. That would be a great reason why someone would not want to be in a registry. Now about that FBI agent that came knocking on my door back around 1988 that is another car story.....
Most states only need the VIN to do a search, name is not needed. There has always been an option to withhold ones name from the printed registry, afaik. I also do not really get the reluctance to offer info on the car while still being able to be anonymous from the printed version.
The 87 registry had only a state. Rick took any Shelby that was in Mi and ran the vin through the SOS. At that time i believe Vinny tagged my car at a SAAC show here in Deaborn (85 or6?) and left his card under my wiper so it is possible that that is why it said Mi in the 87. 97 and up my name is on it. Not afraid to have my name associated in the registry and I have done it 3 times now. I agree on cars being registered and offered why some don't. I try and talk people into registering cars and I'm sure Vinny can attest to that as I have sent cars to the Vin man before that were not previously known and have talked people into registering. To Doug I did mention what Michigan does and said other states could differ as I knew they did.
Mongo/Vinman are on call 24/7 to help in registering any 68-69-70 Shelbys even if owner wants their names withelld !
I know where there's a Highland green 350, 4-spd, saddle interior , a/c car. :) And its owner is proud to tell anyone who asks that he has it ! Lucky man !
Based on what I see in the Registry 2020 maybe 60% missing in action.
I am surprised to learn on this thread how many are just tucked away without being registered.
I remember my Porsche days going to the dismantler and inquiring how he can possibly have all these "brand new" turbo parts.
His reponse was great. Most Turbos that are totaled have less than 500 miles on them as everyone can get up to speed only knowing how to apply the brakes properly keeps them from being totaled.
My guess is the same happened back in the day with most Shelby's just my opinion.
Quote from: Copescobra on February 14, 2022, 08:10:52 PM
Based on what I see in the Registry 2020 maybe 60% missing in action.
I am surprised to learn on this thread how many are just tucked away without being registered.
I remember my Porsche days going to the dismantler and inquiring how he can possibly have all these "brand new" turbo parts.
His reponse was great. Most Turbos that are totaled have less than 500 miles on them as everyone can get up to speed only knowing how to apply the brakes properly keeps them from being totaled.
My guess is the same happened back in the day with most Shelby's just my opinion.
It may be a grey area. I'm wondering how many are just laying out there in fields or "dismantling yards"? I'm not sure that I would describe that as having survived?
The quantity of "original" '68 parts showing up for sale in the usual places really doesn't account any where near for the total that are not accounted for.
It really is kind of a mystery and tends to defy explanation.
People should probably stop now. This post is embarrassing too many people
Quote from: Tired Sheep on February 15, 2022, 09:22:40 AM
People should probably stop now. This post is embarrassing too many people
Not embarrassing enough to show a sudden surge of registrations though, unfortunately.
Well said Shelbydoug !!!
If you are still standing on the sidelines and have not registered your Shelby of any year please do so.
I'll leave it at that.