Was This Really Necessary?

[shelbydoug]

You also need to realize that tire development has tremendously effected these times.

Most of the tires were like $39.99. There was a department store here called Floyd's. The street racers were buying RECAPS for $19.95 each. Those things would hook up like slicks.

I test drove a Porsche Camen with a PDK transmission. It's like a 270hp engine and does 0-60 in like 3.3 seconds. Everything  is tuned to run that time. You just leave it in automatic and punch it.

The difference today is the tires, the cpu, and the gearing. If you know what you are doing, a vintage GT350 can do 12's. The 500 isn't that easy to drive. You need to pussy that thing just right and you need to balast the trunk quite a bit for traction, but it's a doable 11 second car in the RIGHT hands. If you don't know what you are doing, you will just spin the tires the entire length of the track like you're driving in snow.

Basically you need to short shift it. There no doubt are some legit 10 second 500's here?

[FL SAAC]

Mr R
You sir are the exception to the rule making you a true 1 %
Be well

It has always cracked me up listening to old muscle car owners fondly remembering how fast their cars were back in the day.  The best any one of them
could do was low 14's, if that.  Big block vettes or camaros could get in the 13's, but that's about it.  Shelbys were just too slow.  Sorry boys.  I know because I ran them all.  My TVR could do high 12's and never lost a street race against anyone, but my son's stock coyote mustang gt would kick my ass now three times over!

     The Mel Burns '65 GT350 ran high 12's in '66. It took me until '67 to get into the 12's with my Paxton blower equipped 289. By '69 I was in the 11's and by '72 I ran a best of 11.42 at 124 , before I ripped the axle housing off of the perches. "Some us " WERE fast back then , and still are.
     Randy

[FL SAAC]

Car & Driver - review on the Ford Mustang GT auto

At the test track, the automatic's advantage was clear as it better harnessed the 460 horses and 420 lb-ft of Ford's latest and melodious 5.0-liter V-8: The 10-speed GT rocketed to 60 mph in 3.8 seconds versus the manual's 4.3, and it shaved half a second off the quarter-mile run, posting a 12.1 at 120 mph compared to a 12.6 at 115 mph.
......................................................

Slap a supercharger or a twin hair dryer and a tune, suspension, rear axles, tires, you will dominate 99% of what's on the street today.

It's relative.Back in the day I did really well.Then came the 5.0 mustangs with crazy gears (for the street)

[shelbydoug]

I think what we are looking at with the automatic vs. manual is the gearing. It's difficult for a 5 or 6 speed manual to compete with a 8 or 10 speed automatic that works.

A driver can't even think as fast as the automatic is. It already beat you to the shift before it even hit your brain to shift.


In the '60s, it was about marketability. What was practical for a manufacture to attempt to sell?

The first 5 speed transmission that I know of to appear was the ZF that found it's way into the GT40, the Mangusta and Pantera.


If you follow the negatives from Ford on it, you will see that there was immediate resistance to it.

After all, the basic transmission in the production Mustang was still a 3 speed. 0-60 times were still just technical data listed by the car magazines.

A 5 speed manual? Common? Our customers can't even count that high?


Consider the hot tire of the time. The Goodyear polyglass with raised white letters. It was marketed as a "performance tire" and by the standards of the time, it was...but it really wasn't. It was just a marketing ploy like adding "Boss stripes" to a car to make it "cool".


There are enough 2v v8 station wagons still that run in the 10's in the 1/4, simply because traction and gearing were dealt with correctly.

The performance transmission of the era was a 4 speed with a 2.32 first gear. Combine that with a 3.50 rear and that car wasn't going anywhere very fast off of the line BUT it was relative to everything else offered.

In order to get a good 1/4 time, with a 2.32 first gear, you needed 4.88 rears? That's all you could do to get the gearing. Now manual transmissions all start in first gear with around 3.25's



An 11 second street car isn't that easy to drive. Particularly when it tears out, rear axle mounts and in my case, crinkles the roof on both sides?

Not only that, but my $5.99 Tom McCanns were pretty slippery on the pedals. I didn't get my first Joe Namath leather Puma's until about 1970. Those changed the driving dynamics somewhat also.


I do remember having a discussion with a Ford "Engineer" back around then and his answer was basically in a very undignified tone of basically, "Ford doesn't sell race cars for the street kid. Get lost. Get a hair cut".

That's before the expression, "eat me" became popular but I can point to the origins of the phrase.

Funny how publicly Ford has become respectful of the grey hair...and yes, I still do need a hair cut...so "eat me". 

[FL SAAC]

Great statement and very valid , back in the day ;

An 11 second street car isn't that easy to drive. Particularly when it tears out, rear axle mounts and in my case, crinkles the roof on both sides? 

Today it is achievable with your ac and radio playing tunes.

[shelbydoug]

Great statement and very valid , back in the day ;

An 11 second street car isn't that easy to drive. Particularly when it tears out, rear axle mounts and in my case, crinkles the roof on both sides?

Today it is achievable with your ac and radio playing tunes.

Yup. Just like a video game.

I've got factory a/c.

Tony, you have got to put away the sports cards. If you say something doesn't exist, you had better be able to put up or shut up.

Basically put, you are full of shit and you are just embarrassing yourself on this counter culture, counter information campaign that you are on.

It's you man. It's not me.

[gt350hr]

    Dodge Hellcat. Plunk down $70 grand , add some drag radials , DRIVE to the track with the air on getting well over 20 MPG. Run some 10 second ETs ( having the air on slows you by less than a tenth) , and drive back home at 20+ MPG. No rollbar needed because it's "stock". It is the cheapest "off the showroom floor" production car with 10 second capability. They are all over the place out here. Yes times have changed.
   Randy

[557]

Also bear in mind if something goes wrong at speed in a vintage car the stakes are WAY higher than in a new car.No airbags,engineered crush zones,etc.,etc.etc. Where you might walk away without a scratch in a new car,in the old one you might end up eating the steering wheel or worse...."food for thought" ...be safe.

[FL SAAC]

Good afternoon Doug,

Why so mad?

Let's address your points;

1) What does not exist?

I said some vintage vehicles ran in the 11 with the proper massaging . They are the 1%

2) No I am not full of feces, I discharged my bowels this morning

3) What counter information do you speak of ?

Have a great day

Yup. Just like a video game.

I've got factory a/c.

Tony, you have got to put away the sports cards. If you say something doesn't exist, you had better be able to put up or shut up.

Basically put, you are full of shit and you are just embarrassing yourself on this counter culture, counter information campaign that you are on.

It's you man. It's not me.

[shelbydoug]

Good afternoon Doug,

Why so mad?

Let's address your points;

1) What does not exist?

I said some vintage vehicles ran in the 11 with the proper massaging . They are the 1%

2) No I am not full of feces, I discharged my bowels this morning

3) What counter information do you speak of ?

Have a great day

Yup. Just like a video game.

I've got factory a/c.

Tony, you have got to put away the sports cards. If you say something doesn't exist, you had better be able to put up or shut up.

Basically put, you are full of shit and you are just embarrassing yourself on this counter culture, counter information campaign that you are on.

It's you man. It's not me.

Good to know. You are such an overwhelming source of accurate information.

[gt350hr]

  How about you two go to PM's?

[SBCARGUY]

+1

[KR500]

+2

[FL SAAC]

Gentlemen will do
Thank you

https://www.motor1.com/news/408919/shelby-gt350-combine-harvester-drag-race-video/

[shelbydoug]

  How about you two go to PM's?